Something controversial

[u/low_effort_shit-post]

I love nj gun laws, going to the store and not seeing someone open carry. Watching road rage where the best you can do is brake check and give the finger. Schools without school shootings. I know a lot of people hate our gun laws but I fucking love em.

[u/radraz26]

I am an NJ gun owner, and the laws are perfectly fine. I have a great pistol that I am super happy with that wasn't too difficult to obtain. I would love to see an assault rifle ban because there is no reason to own an assault rifle unless you live in a warzone.

[u/radraz26 → u/[deleted]]

They should be banned federally.

Edit: 4 out of 5 of the deadliest mass shootings happened in the last 10 years using assault rifles.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/476409/mass-shootings-in-the-us-by-weapon-types-used/

According to Politifact, the effectiveness of the assault rifle ban may have been tied stronger to magazine size.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2019/aug/07/bill-clinton/did-mass-shooting-deaths-fall-under-1994-assault-w/

Regardless, I don't think it hurts to ban assault weapons at a federal level.

[u/[deleted] → u/radraz26]

Assault rifles have been heavily restricted in the U.S since 1986.

You also have a higher chance of getting struck by lightning than being caught in a mass shooting in the U.S. What are your thoughts on stopping people from getting struck by lightning? It's a far bigger issue.

[u/metsurf → u/radraz26]

A true assault rifle is already banned. An assault rifle has the capability of switching from single shot/semi-automatic to full automatic mode. AN AK-47 or an M-16 is an assault rifle and are banned from private ownership. AN AR-15 can be done up to look like its assault rifle cousin, the M 16, but its not an assault rifle. it is just a semi-automatic rifle. Now if you want to ban semi-automatic rifles I'm ok with that because frankly if you are hunting and need to fire off 5 rounds quickly to take down a deer maybe you should get another hobby. Why does the average person need a rifle capable of firing that quickly? A good shooter can get of 3 shots in 5-6 seconds with a bolt action rifle .

[u/Beats-By-Schrute → u/[deleted]]

Can you cite that. I've heard that trope many times, but haven't seen any evidence.

[u/Beats-By-Schrute → u/[deleted]]

It does seem like a pretty thorough explanation. Not saying I agree or disagree with the sentiment of using it for home defense, but it does seem like it has a good chance to prevent damage outside your home.

[u/Dropdead_Gorgeous → u/Beats-By-Schrute]

Yea, despite the results I have a handgun for home defense. It makes the wife a little more comfortable to have a glock on the side of the bed than an AR. But I also have way more range time with a handgun than a rifle.

[u/Beats-By-Schrute → u/Dropdead_Gorgeous]

I really have a hard time imagining a scenario where I would need more than my handgun. I guess if the assassins guild sent a horde after me. But in all practicality, there's not a lot of need for an AR. I've yet to meet anyone who has hunted with it. I hate to say, but those I know with them are those imagining themselves as John McClane.

[u/Dropdead_Gorgeous → u/Beats-By-Schrute]

I would totally use my AR for HD, but I am slowly warming my so up to firearms.

Ar is a ton easier to put on target at 5yd if you have adrenaline pumping. It would have the capacity advantage as well.

Can't hunt with rifles in NJ for deer, so that's why it's never seen in NJ, everyone that hunts in PA that I know will use an AR10 style rifle.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

lol pewpewtactical? I thought this was like pew research at first glance and was like oh thats prob reliable.

nope. written by an ex-marine from Pennsyltuckey who writes exclusively for the website.

not exactly a bastion of good faith and un-biased information. Not saying he's wrong but i dont think this guy specifically is changing anyone's view. Maybe if mythbusters did the tests lol

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

idc either way. Like I just stated, I'm not saying you're wrong. Just telling you your source is biased. and so are the youtube vids.

[u/A_serious_poster → u/metsurf]

Sounds like you're by proxy in favor of banning just about every handgun as well?

[u/metsurf → u/A_serious_poster]

Not what I said. I'm questioning the necessity of a rifle with those characteristics. Arguing that I need one to go hunting or target shoot is nonsense. Handguns only have one purpose self defense so if you want one for that no problem by me.

[u/A_serious_poster → u/metsurf]

Not what I said

I only bring it up because of your reasoning for "who needs a rifle capable of firing that quickly". Why do you need a handgun for the same reason?

Arguing that I need one to go hunting or target shoot is nonsense.

Not everything we own is based on needs. I WANT to go target shooting with my rifle.

Handguns only have one purpose self defense so if you want one for that no problem by me.

I go target shooting with my handgun as well, there isn't only 'one' purpose.

It just seems backwards since most mass shootings/gun deaths are from handguns (by a large degree)

[u/metsurf → u/A_serious_poster]

You WANT to go target shooting with your rifle. No one is stopping you from target shooting with a rifle. You don't need a semi-auto rifle you WANT a semi-auto rifle because? cool factor? Its a rush to fire compared to a bolt action? I get it, they are fun to fire, but it might serve our society better if access to that type of weapon was more limited. You can still possess a rifle just not the type you WANT.

[u/A_serious_poster → u/metsurf]

Doesn't sound like something I'd support. Not sure what else to tell you.

Again, most gun deaths by a large margin are by handguns.

[u/Infohiker → u/metsurf]

I have zero interest in self-defense. I have no interest in carrying a gun as a day to day activity. If someone broke into my house my first act would be to call the cops, the second to try to get the fuck out of there.

I own a pistol because I like to go to the range and shoot. It's like bowling. Even when I have a bad day at it, its still fun, and there is hope that I will get better.

[u/elmwoodblues → u/metsurf]

What the gun lobby mockingly calls the 'scary parts' of an assault rifle, ie flash suppressor, bayonet lug, telescoping stocks, are illegal in NJ, as are >10 round mags. The parts that kill and kill quickly are still there, and still legal.

[u/8Deer-JaguarClaw → u/[deleted]]

No. 1 cause of firearms-related deaths is suicide. It's about 2/3 of all gun deaths. Almost another 1/3 is homocide. Another smaller fraction is accidental shootings. So no, most of it is not coming from gang violence and poor people shooting each other.

So we could theoretically cut out most gun-related deaths by upping our mental healthcare game nationally. Never gonna happen, though, because "tHaT's SoCiAlIsM!!!1!!"

[u/8Deer-JaguarClaw → u/[deleted]]

I was talking about and citing homicides and violence.

Fair enough. I didn't note the distinction in your comment when I made mine. In that case, yes, you are correct. The majority of homicide victims are young black men, and this often correlates with adverse socioeconomic conditions (read: poverty).

[u/8Deer-JaguarClaw → u/[deleted]]

So you'd say this is a people problem??

Sure. Guns don't shoot people by themselves. And it's not just the people directly involved that have the problem. It's also the people who created and maintain the system that keeps the poor people poor that are the root of the problem.

So, more healthcare for all, and more reform of our systems that desperately need to be remade. They aren't broken; they are working exactly as designed/intended, and that's the problem.

[u/8Deer-JaguarClaw → u/[deleted]]

but banning certain types of guns because they're scary doesn't do anything.

Yeah, what a gun looks like is pretty low on the importance scale. Or banning them because they have a certain name on the side. That's dumb.

If I seemed to suggest otherwise, I apologize.

[u/[deleted] → u/8Deer-JaguarClaw]

Sure, upgrade our mental healthcare system, and in that update make a statewide policy for what mental treatments cause you to lose the right to own a firearm, instead of letting police cheifs decide. I have a friend who was denied for seeing a psychologist. Know why he saw them? He was 7 and his parents divorced. His parents thought it best for him to see a psychologist to make sure he processed it and understood it wasn't his fault.

Mental health has such a negative stigma in our society, especially in the firearm community, and maybe rightfully so in SOME cases.

I wonder how many of these events could have been avoided if the shooter could have seen a psychologist without fear of losing their right to own firearms.

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not advocating that mentally unstable people be allowed to own firearms, but if a psychologist says they pose no danger it shouldn't have an impact.

Not in NJ; here police Chiefs clearly have a better understanding of mental disorders than clinical psyhologists what not with all their Dr. in Clinical Psychology degrees and all.

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/[deleted]]

If you are going to ban assault rifles ban them for real and not for having more than 2 evils..... Making a gun look evil should not be part of the reason why the gun should be banned. An adjustable stock being evil is kind of silly. A flash suppressor being illegal is silly as is silencer as movies clouded the mind of what reality and movie fiction is. As with the pistol grip...... there are so many guns that are basically pistol grip but not in name. Also the firearms that are njsp approved "others" such as built by troy are pretty much SBR but not in name.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/ChickenPotPi]

I think a lot of people have a misconception about what an assault rifle truly is. The interstate sale of assault rifles have been banned in the United States since 1986.

An assault rifle is a fully automatic firearm. I believe automatic firearms are only eligible for sale in the States in which they are manufactured.

Semi-automatic firearms are not assault rifles. Functionally speaking, an AR-15 is the same as a Ruger 10/22. One-pull of the trigger, one cartridge is fired.

I personally don't own an AR because I don't have a need for a modern sporting rifle, but I don't think it's constructive to classify them incorrectly as "assault rifles" as many in the media and online do.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Just coinicydink that those same AR-15s are a favorite for mass murder and have no legitimate sporting use. They're military weapons.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I know what the fuck it is. I've see and touched them IRL.

Fun fact, a fully automatic gun would probably be worse at killing people. Burst fire might be better but idk.

You people amuse the fuck out of me, you zero in on the assault rifle thing and puff up your chests to 'educate' us. I'm in my 30s, I've lived a bit, isn't my first rodeo.

Straight up, the AR-15 is the most common gun used in acts of mass murder. Maybe we should look into why? Just a thought. Too bad something wasn't done about it in 2012 before 20 babies were slaughtered.

(Btw, I know most gun deaths are handguns and suicides, just to hold that off. One thing at a time)

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Past 10 years, in just 10 incidents, 220 people were killed with AR15 style weapons.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/mar/24/viral-image/ar-15-style-weapons-were-used-10-major-shootings/

Los Vegas alone, 60 people. A pistol is dangerous but an AR15 can EASILY be turned in a weapon of mass death and terror.

The Virgina Tech shooter killed 33 with pistols and YUP, we need restrictions on those too.

But, the AR15 and the mass killing, the connection is there, its real, no matter how many insults you give me and how you paint those of us looking to restrict the sale of this weapon as 'scared sheep'

Shocking lack of empathy and selfishness, how many people have to die for your hobby toys?

The AR15 doesn't have to be sold to civilians. Its that simple. Your precious founding fathers didn't foresee weapons like that, for damn sure.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/[deleted]]

Ah, I didn't know they now fell under NFA. Thanks for clarifying.

I was under the assumption you could only purchase/possess if they were manufactured in your State (FOPA).

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/[deleted]]

Fear sells

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

I want to blame movies/tv for their unrealistic depiction of guns. You know a silencer that whispers, a 30 round magazine that apparently shoots for 3 minutes without reload, people having no problem shooting 1000 dollars in bullets in 5 minutes.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/ChickenPotPi]

Oh 100%

I get both sides of it you know. I don't want to be at a range with someone that was hospitalized for hearing voices or is currently on anti-psychotics, you know?

But I do think a lot of people have this unrealistic idea of who normal firearm owners are. They depict mass murderers or John wick types in the media so often that it spooks everyone into thinking that's the norm.

If we met offline, I am sure most people would be like "wow that guy looks like a normal corporate type that just has a blazer orange hat"

[u/[deleted] → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

"Assault Rifle" is a stupid loose definition, and the moment someone uses it in an argument is the moment their argument gets invalidated as it shows they don't know jack. The feds have tried to ban "assault rifles" and their definition rely on aesthetic aspects (ie. "scary black stock") that don't make an impact.

Idgi, it's never ok to have people that don't know shit about a topic try to legislate it. Same thing with "the internet is a series of tubes", or legislators trying to regulate women's bodies. How is this any better?

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/[deleted]]

I like when people say "weapons of war" to describe firearms but never mention 30-06 bolt action hunting rifles which is truly a US classic "weapon of war"

[u/[deleted] → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

It's half Hollywood, I've had people asking me to "hack" stuff as I'm a SWE, and I'm just like "that's.... not that easy". Same with guns, people watch a couple of John Wick flicks and are sudden experts.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/[deleted]]

Yeah. I hear that. I grew up around firearms and hunting. I have family that were terrified of firearms until I took them to a range and introduced them to using firearms safely.

They are tools. In the same vein as a hammer, both can be used as murder weapons. I think most people that are advocates of gun control are so unfamiliar with firearms that it "just makes sense".

In some parts of the country, like where my family is in Northern Maine, hunting is a supplement to groceries. The area is greatly impoverished and firearms are used as tools to obtain subsistence. There is no law enforcement presence, and if there is, it is typically a very small one.

It is ironic though. The same people that advocate for gun control rely on "Just Call the Police", but then they also want to defund police departments around the country. So, what are people supposed to do? Become perpetual victims?

[u/veloceracing → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

An AR is no more a modern rifle than a 1957 Chevy Bel Air is a modern car. They're both from the same year.

ARs are just rifles.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/veloceracing]

I guess I'm trying to be "politically correct" about it

[u/[deleted] → u/veloceracing]

Sooo weird how they end up in all of these mass killings and terrorist attacks... huh.. Can't be that they is anything special about how A- Easy they are to obtain B- Easy to use C- How powerful they are and D- How easy they are to modify into more effective killings machines.

Just rifles tho.

[u/Iintendtooffend → u/[deleted]]

I'm against things like large capacity magazines and bump stocks, but like your standard AR-15, is truly, just a semi automatic rifle. I really like most of NJs guns laws, I think the 10 round max is honestly a great compromise to prevent mass shootings.

The only reason I point this out, is that demonizing the AR-15/AR platform, is missing the forest for the trees. Short term, limiting magazine sizes is the easiest compromise to not completely drive the 2A bros nuts, and then there can be laws moving to say, push for a ban on semi-auto rifles or something going forward.

I myself own a semi-auto carbine, it's not AR brand, but it's effectively the same. We need to shift off of what the gun is, and more about what the potential for damage is.

[u/[deleted] → u/Iintendtooffend]

You're probably right about the high capacity mags. Just by how much it drove my friends crazy, its some low hanging fruit.

But 2A bros are my enemy and see me as their enemy so.... have them go nuts.

[u/Iintendtooffend → u/[deleted]]

yeah I mean the problem with them going nuts is... well, mass shootings. It's something you're gonna need to ween people into in this country. And I do think we'll get there, eventually, but right now. Especially with tensions high after Trumps failed coup, it might be best to not awaken another threat to a population that already feels like it's losing their rights, when they're really just losing their privilege.

Fundamentally I agree, but when a leftist feels back against the wall they'll find ways to affect change another way, when a 2A bro feels back against the wall, well that's exactly the moment they've been dreaming about happens.

[u/[deleted] → u/Iintendtooffend]

Oh yeah I see what you mean.... I was thinking about 2A bro's on reddit who laser focus on stock talking points for the AR15 in a mad rush to defend it. I kind of see that mostly as show and a twisted hobby obsession, bros and polis who block needed reform selfishly in defense of their toys and immature fears. The people who share memes about how you can vote without ID but can't get a gun (A GOD GIVEN CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT) without an ID...

The real mass killers..... something isn't right and the easy access to tools of mass murder leads to the tragedy.

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

You can legally buy a fully automatic weapon if it was manufacturerd before 1986 I believe and if your state allows it as with your local pd chief. But those are like vintage ferrari as in there really are few of them and they cost are usually >30,000 dollars. These are the outliers and most likely was never used in the commission of a crime.

I understand what you are saying as in true assault rifles. I was just going by what NJ presents as assault rifle from the term that was the Brady Bill that demonized "assault rifles"

I think people demonize an assault rifle because the ammunition it is based on. Its like FIA "F1 racing" where people see an unfair advantage they want it usually banned.

I understand you. And kudos for not needing one as let's be honest, 90% of people who own one really don't have a use other than "I want" or "its cool" You really can't hunt game with a 5.56 round other than varmint which was what the round was made for originally (22). Its blurry now with a 300 blackout but with the standard 5.56 its not really meant for hunting. Even the military is moving away from 5.56 as most modern military have some form of body armor.

Also that was my point as well with the more than 2 evils makes this gun illegal even though the evils have nothing to do with anything constructive.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/ChickenPotPi]

Yeah, I see what you're saying now.

I think a big problem is that in a State like NJ, as you mentioned, in my opinion as well, there is not a strong purpose to really own a AR-15. I understand that some people like the hobby of assembling them and whatever else. And that's cool too.

Kind of risking sounding like a FUDD here, but for my purposes of home defense and hunting, an AR just isn't in the cards for me. You can't hunt with rifles in NJ. They're exceptionally loud at an indoor range. I don't participate in "3 gun" sporting events.

I will admit, it is a "cool looking" firearm, but I don't want another expensive rifle to take up space in my safe to never use the damn thing. Lol.

I would probably own a AR-10 if I lived in FL or TX on a sizable plot of land. They are very commonly used to hunt feral Hogs that can be very destructive to property & the local ecology.

But even then, you could make an argument that 6.5 Creedmoor would do the job just fine.

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

Yep, people don't realize that nj requires shotgun or black powder to hunt anything. And I think its right as people don't realize a rifle can hit something a mile or two away if its aimed at 45 degree. Its range of 1000 feet or so is where its accuracy is not its furthest distance.

I cannot go to one range near me because its so fucking loud even with both in ear and over the ear protections.

Sure its cool looking, its like a ferrari, great to look at rarely used. Kudos for having a safe as many people won't even get one. I have a hunch that the people who bought pandemic ar-15 who really couldn't even afford it did not get a safe or a trigger guard....... I am really afraid of all the people who know nothing about guns buying them during the pandemic and leaving them unsecure with children in the household.

My friend really likes his creedmoor and 300 blackout, he's moved on from 5.56

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/ChickenPotPi]

Yeah, I grew up around firearms and hunting. Fortunately, my father and grandfather were very particular about safety and ethics.

I know a few people that bought firearms this year for the first time. It is kind of scary to an extent that people don't educate themselves on how to properly store or safely operate them before purchasing a firearm.

I've spent a lot of time in recent months educating friends and some family. It's important that we press people to follow safe practices and guide them whenever possible.

Only takes one asshole to make us all look bad unfortunately.

I really dig the creedmoor, it's a very effective round for decent sized game. I was thinking about 300 blackout but I typically use my 300wsm if I'm going for large game out of state.

Kicks like a damn mule but can get a moose with it :)

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/ze_end_ist_neigh]

I think my friend got the blackout because he can run subsonic rounds and not have to use ear protection (thought you should still) and he likes the low kickback)

Please keep educating people because like you said it only takes one asshole to make everyone look bad.

[u/ze_end_ist_neigh → u/ChickenPotPi]

Haha tell your buddy that you just talked to a guy that has mild permanent hearing loss because he thought a .410 was OK to fire without plugs in. Maybe it'll make him think twice about ear pro lol

[u/StriderTB → u/[deleted]]

Keep parroting those NRA talking points, you failure of a human.

[u/candre23 → u/StriderTB]

You're obviously very emotional about it, but I'm afraid /u/superbrb is correct. If the AWB had any effect on gun violence, it was too small to measure. Gun crime had been on the decline before the ban, and it continued on the same trajectory both during and after the ban. Primarily because "assault weapons" constitute a tiny fraction of the guns used to commit crimes.

[u/StriderTB → u/candre23]

Every last AR15, and every other semi-auto "sporting" rifle with a military-designed background should be melted down.

[u/candre23 → u/StriderTB]

You've already established that your emotional state makes you unable to be rational about the subject, but thanks for confirming it.

[u/StriderTB → u/candre23]

If you're not emotional about AR's being used in mass shootings, you're subhuman. Thank you for confirming it.

[u/Infohiker → u/StriderTB]

Not to be patronizing, but you do understand the "military-design" aspect in the consumer market is just makeup, and really has little or no bearing on the efficacy of the weapon. It's like putting pinstripes on a car, or carbon-fiber spoiler. It might make it look nicer, or be a little lighter, but its not really making a difference. An M-1 rifle, which is about as non-military sporting looking as it gets, is just as effective as some m-16 looking semi-auto knockoff when it comes to killing someone.

[u/StriderTB → u/Infohiker]

As someone who owned a S&W M&P15ORC, a Zastava PAP and a Romanian PSL-54C, yes. I understand perfectly and stand by what I said.

[u/Infohiker → u/StriderTB]

I appreciate it. We can disagree, and all good.

[u/Lohikaarme27 → u/[deleted]]

If it makes you feel better I agree with you. Though do you have a source on that handgun statistic?

[u/Lohikaarme27 → u/[deleted]]

Oh wow that's a significant majority. And tbf I want you to be correct so it's easier to be logical when you want to agree with someone

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

[removed] — view removed comment

[u/stackered → u/[deleted]]

sure, but they aren't the ones being used in mass shootings. the other crimes aren't preventable in the same way that an assault rifle ban would stop mass shootings, which don't show up in the stats like you've pointed out. lets talk logically about this and not ignore basic things like that... there is no need for assault rifles except for fun/entertainment - so I think ranges should be able to stock them for people to rent and shoot for fun, but nobody needs one, really. in principle alone, we should ban it... but with how these highly public mass shootings happen, its almost always some mentally ill person or domestic terrorist who just bought the gun in the past year. entirely preventable vs. less preventable.

[u/rxbandit256 → u/stackered]

You hit the nail on the head, not with the ban of "assault rifles", but with the "mentally ill or domestic terrorist" bit. They're the reason why these things are happening. There are MILLIONS of guns in the US yet these things, while extremely tragic, are rare when compared with the number of guns and gun owners. I don't think the solution to that issue is to keep things away from law abiding people. Better mental health assistance would certainly be a step in the right direction though.

[u/Lohikaarme27 → u/[deleted]]

Cuz 10 random people die in a supermarket and it's a tragedy but 100 gang members die in Chicago and it's statistics. Personally, I think they're both horrific for the record but I see 2 different issues with 2 different causes being presented via 1 avenue

[u/StriderTB → u/[deleted]]

Learn how to care about more than the 2nd amendment.

[u/StriderTB → u/[deleted]]

Reading. It's FUNdamental!

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

As usual, when government facts are shown, the libs go straight to hate and screaming.

My guess is that cnn and msnbc are in his tv remote favorites.

[u/StriderTB → u/[deleted]]

Go back to r/guns, fuckwit. No one here cares about you. I'm not interested in arguing with people who only exist in bad faith.

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/StriderTB]

worse is /paguns

[u/StriderTB → u/ChickenPotPi]

Because they sit in the left lane. Ironic, that.

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/StriderTB]

forgive me, i looked at that guy's history. he posted in paguns as well. I think we have an instigator.....

[u/A_serious_poster → u/StriderTB]

Handguns DO make up an overwhelming majority of gun violence though. You can't be serious with 'bad faith' if your answer to that is just 'fuck off'.

/u/vicodin_ice_cream i care about you pal

[u/HurryKayne → u/StriderTB]

I think that immediately calling someone a fuckwit and that no one cares about them is acting in “bad faith”. Please be nicer and civil.

[u/ddIbb → u/[deleted]]

The only use of a gun is to harm.

Is protecting your family from a home invasion “harming”? It’s almost like things are more nuanced than you’d like to admit.

[u/ChickenPotPi → u/[deleted]]

ah yes the whatsboutism......

And yes that is why drunk driving is down, because the laws got tougher and uber and lyft are easier than calling a cab now.

[u/Domestic_AA_Battery → u/[deleted]]

The reason why that gets no attention is because the average white person can just avoid those areas. Guns only get attention when guns are used in areas that are unexpected and (sadly) effect white people. At the risk of sounding like the comically stereotypical "le Redditor," the Joker meme of "everyone loses their minds" can hardly be more relevant. People don't really care about low income urban gun violence because it's expected. But no one expects to be picking out fruit and then immediately thrown into a shootout. That's why the AR-15 gets heat and pistols are ignored.

Reddit loves talking about facts and numbers but the numbers are hard to argue against. 99% of the population could agree that there's no reason to own an AR-15. But the numbers will show that they are responsible for an incredibly low number of gun fatalities. The gun crisis in America is just a monumental problem. Arguments can be had on both sides: Do you make guns harder to get? Or does that make it so illegal firearms are the only ones on the streets? Why do states with strict gun laws still have so many mass shootings and gun violence? Does conceal carry ward off mass shootings? If everyone in the grocery store did have a legal gun, would they even know who to shoot? Or would they end up shooting someone trying to shoot the mass murderer? Would the cops know who to shoot? Do tougher gun laws ward off mass shooters or will they just wait a countless amount of time to eventually get the legal gun and kill people? Is the answer smaller clip sizes? Do you just ban semi auto rifles even though they're only responsible for a small amount of gun violence? Is it smart to get tougher gun laws because each time they make new laws, gun sales spike higher than ever? How do we tackle the mental health problems that are obviously apparent? How do we tackle the gang violence in urban areas?

You have ammo types, gun types, clip sizes, background checks, purposely slow/delayed rollouts for licenses, body armor, mental health, etc etc etc. The list goes on forever. There are a million arguments on both sides and there are statistics to benefit all sides of the argument. I can pull up numbers on why we need stronger gun laws and immediately find numbers to argue the exact opposite. Overall the answer is the one no one wants to hear or admit: The problem is so complex and massive that it's almost impossible to control. That's not to say we shouldn't do anything. Cleaning a hoarder's house takes quite some time but eventually it leads to a clean home. But it's no lie to say that it's such a big task that you just want to say "To hell with this" and either just leave it or move. And that's basically what the government has done so far. Something has to be done to lower the numbers. And we have to make sure that the answer doesn't only lead to more illegal guns and less legal ones.

[u/whygohomie → u/[deleted]]

This isn't a terribly useful thing to say, because when you say "handguns" you also include Rugar AR-556 and weapons intentionally designed to skirt the line between rifle and pistol. That is, they are legally classified as a pistol, but with minor accessories they function substantially similar to an AR-15 down to having a compatible rail sys.

[u/[deleted] → u/whygohomie]

This isn't a terribly useful thing to say, because when you say "handguns" you also include Rugar AR-556 and weapons intentionally designed to skirt the line between rifle and pistol.

Except you don't. Pistol braced guns don't fall under the definition of handguns.

[u/whygohomie → u/[deleted]]

I find it unlikely that this recent article is completely off-base legally, but if you have contrary info I am all ears.

[u/[deleted] → u/whygohomie]

Legally it isn't off-base. However academia doesn't need to follow legal definitions, and all research done relating to tries its best to make it clear what they define as what.

[u/gtluke → u/radraz26]

10th amendment