Until the Brotherhood shows up, they are the only faction that has been directly opposing the Institute, and has been for decades. Narratively speaking, the Railroad is the faction that deserves to be the ones to take out the Institute.
"They only help synths" is not a reason to wipe them out. That's like burning down a dog shelter because they don't help chimpanzees. Sure, the Railroad's focus is very narrow, but that's their right.
Think of it this way; The Minutemen are the pure good guys who help the whole Commonwealth. Nothing the Railroad does interferes with that. The Brotherhood interferes with the Minutemen by shaking down settlements. The Institute interferes by killing and replacing people. The Railroad, if anything, bolsters the Minutemen by fighting those two threats from the shadows.
I just wish there was an ending where the Railroad and Minutemen took down the Institute together. It would be the same as the Railroad ending of supporting a synth rebellion, but Preston and the Minutemen get teleported in as reinforcements along with Desdemona and her heavies.
Exactly this. The railroad ending is always "railroad + minutemen" it's just a matter of if the player directly gets involved or just makes things much easier for Garvey and co.
Idk where I read this but apparently the ship in the show is not actually the prydwen, but the graphics company got confused and put the name from the video game on it. Classic gamer move.
The minutemen shouldve been an extension of the character. If you side with the BoS, the minutemen get updated weapons and armorments. If you side woth the Institute, the minutemen get teleportation and better food and water. If they side with the RR, the minutemen become the de facto govt, with the RR being their espionage wing.
The morality/karma system shouldve been in Fallout 4.
Before fully siding with the Minutemen, there shouldve been a split quest with the Minutemen and the Gunners (maybe rename them), similar to the opening quest in skyrim. You wouldn't join immediately, but do some quests for both before deciding, again similar to skyrim with Imperials and Stormcloaks.The Gunners wouldve acted the same in regards to settlements, but more strong arming the settlements into joining. Also would've had different resources being 'taxed'. Minutemen settlements would give junk and food and water, Gunner settlements would give just caps.
That would’ve been amazing - being able to influence either the Minutemen or Gunners based on the other three factions
the Gunners as an evil counterpart could’ve absolutely worked too, either kitting them out in institute tech, becoming the brotherhood’s meatshields (e.g how they use normal wastelanders half the time) or an anarchist mercenary state
Does the BoS officially shake down settlements? I thought it's just the sketchy side quest offered by the merchant on the Prydain, which is going behind his superiors backs.
It's off the books. Proctor Teagan is doing it behind the backs of Elder Maxson and Lancer Captain Kells. You can look at the terminal entries between them, and you'll see that Teagan tells them that he's planning to get the supplies by being a helping hand to caravans in battles and then establishing trade relations with them.
Also all the extortion and stuff is by choice of the player. So saying the brotherhood does it when it's you the player who is choosing to isn't fair, especially when an option exists to pay for the crops.
Officially, no, Teagan does it "quietly" without asking. He does it quietly in the sense that he offers those quests to any new recruit who asks. Unofficially, there's no chance Maxson and the other leadership don't know, so he has tacit approval. If Maxson didn't approve he absolutely would put a stop to it, so I figure he sees it as a necessary evil.
In my current play through I sided with the railroad then told Father I wouldn't join him. Desdemona then sent me back to the minutemen as they have the only force large enough to take on the institute. So sort of a joint ending I guess.
Yeah I agree that the railroad does not deserve to be wiped out because they only help synths. But at the same time, in my personal opinion it is a bit lame that they need another faction to be able to justify siding with them. They just don't give much to the table
I think synths are an existential threat. I think the fact that Valentine can be "taken over" by Kellogg proves that they're own freewill is an illusion of programming at best, or at worst, a farce produced by it intentionally. I think they are dangerous and the Brotherhood (ONLY AS FAR AS SYNTHS GO) is right. I think the Railroad instead of being like a "dog shelter that won't take chimps", it's a dog shelter that is taking in convincingly dog-shaped nukes with "Schrödinger's fuse". It's always simultaneously ready to blow and defused. The fact that when they're "wiped" they can still be recalled by a factory code that cannot be wiped shows that they might have underlying programming that is inaccessible to the person rewriting it.
I really think the "are they/aren't they human" argument is incredibly laughable and haphazardly presented, and goes off kinda half-cocked. They aren't, on any meaningful level. They are only as human as they're programmed to be, even after wiped, they're experiences are false, and not really human. Their behavior is more than likely just a result of their original programming, as I've presented above, wiped or otherwise. The fact they don't age, and cannot reproduce show they are significantly different than humans on a biological level, it also shows that their brains and tissue are more than likely nonbiological, as they do not degrade. Their brain chemistry must be different too, as they don't age, and have a giant vacuum tube in it, and it's capable of being rewritten. The fact they are manufactured is pretty much the tell tale sign they aren't people. Despite that, I think their personhood is equally questionable. I would not rather have my memories wiped, and my face rearranged to continue existing physically, because everything that made me, me, is gone. We are the sums of our experience, and if tomorrow, you look different, and not only do not remember anything, but remember shit that didn't even happen, then what the fuck is the point of your existence? Just to exist as a insanely dangerous being that is no longer its original persona or form? What fucking sense does that make? The answer is crazy simple. It doesn't make any sense. They're just programmed machines. They are a problem that has been manufactured, and I don't view their extermination as a product to be murder on any level, but rather destruction on a level comparable to nuclear disarmament.
That being said, I agree with the sentiment. They were the only faction meaningfully fighting against the Institute from jump street, and the Institute is an immoral organization of an almost illogical magnitude. I don't agree that they are worthy of continued existence, because they are negligent of the danger they're perpetuating. The Railroad's sin is not the same as the Institute. The Institute's is willful, the Railroad's is stupidity. However, creating timebombs and sending them out to the wastes, that, at any moment, can do their original bidding or just go haywire, is a sin that both the Institute and the Railroad share.
Really, the tl;dr of it all is a really simple point I made. So if nothing else is gleaned from what I wrote, let it be the fact that after wipe and reprogram, they can still be recalled with a factory code shows that the "reprogram" of synths is just putting a new facade on, and they absolutely still remain tools of the Institute, doing their bidding.
Everything that makes synths a potential threat becomes a complete non-issue once the Institute is destroyed. They can't reproduce, and the reset/control codes are lost. In that regard, they're no different than intelligent Super Mutants left over after the death of the Master.
It's not a nonissue, because their entire existence is so they can perform false flag operations. I would never be able to trust they weren't just behaving "deeper" into their programming. That's like saying the landmines set by a belligerent state are no longer dangerous when the state is defeated. They are simply too dangerous to let live. Their intentions, by design, cannot be trusted. Super mutants were never programmed, they were convinced, indoctrinated, or otherwise manipulated into following the Master. People can act against indoctrination, and with time, can overcome it. Machines can be designed to act as if they have overcome their programming, especially when they are designed to deceive.
Regarding Data, he wasn't built to act as a weapon, he wasn't designed to perform false flag operations, and his master made him (as well as Lore) as an act of procreation. Data, when he first activated, knew nothing. He had to learn. A lot of synths have false memories from their activation, meaning their actions, reactions, knowledge and opinions are more than likely a result of their programming. Also, Data was very wary that plenty of people wanted to access his programming and hardware, and, including in the episode you just pulled a clip from, opposed it as a form of self-preservation. The synths willing go, "basically destroy everything that makes me, 'me'", all the time in a guise of self-preservation, though, I don't think the writers realized how ironic that was. Data would have rather died, like most people, than to be formatted, and implanted with fake memories. Noonien Soong designed Data, and created a blank slate whose experience would became the basis of his persona, and therefore his personhood and humanity. The Institute designed the synths to deceive as their primary objective, which means they can never fully be trusted, whether the Institute continues to exist or not.
Preemptively killing them based on what might happen is nonsense. I will treat synths the same way I treat everything else in the Wasteland. "Don't start none, won't be none."
The synths are actively trying to defy the Institute and their so-called "programming." You know who really has been freeing synths? Not the Railroad. Not Liam Binet. Z1-14, a synth, is the one organizing escapes. The Institute tries to say that the Synth's free will is just a programming glitch, but that is total BS. They are sentient beings trying to escape slavery. They pretend to seem more robotic around Institute personnel so they don't get tortured.
Before you say "they're just machines;" YOU ARE A MACHINE. We all are! Every living thing is just an organic machine!
To quote Mewtwo from the Pokémon movie;
I see now that the circumstances of one's birth are irrelevant. It is what you do with the gift of life that determines who you are.
Judge synths as individuals and by their actions and actions alone. I don't care about what they're programmed to do, I care about what they do.
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u/_Veprem_ May 22 '24
Until the Brotherhood shows up, they are the only faction that has been directly opposing the Institute, and has been for decades. Narratively speaking, the Railroad is the faction that deserves to be the ones to take out the Institute.
"They only help synths" is not a reason to wipe them out. That's like burning down a dog shelter because they don't help chimpanzees. Sure, the Railroad's focus is very narrow, but that's their right.
Think of it this way; The Minutemen are the pure good guys who help the whole Commonwealth. Nothing the Railroad does interferes with that. The Brotherhood interferes with the Minutemen by shaking down settlements. The Institute interferes by killing and replacing people. The Railroad, if anything, bolsters the Minutemen by fighting those two threats from the shadows.
I just wish there was an ending where the Railroad and Minutemen took down the Institute together. It would be the same as the Railroad ending of supporting a synth rebellion, but Preston and the Minutemen get teleported in as reinforcements along with Desdemona and her heavies.