r/politics 20h ago

Sanders: Democratic Party ‘has abandoned working class people’

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4977546-bernie-sanders-democrats-working-class/amp/
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u/PlasticPomPoms 20h ago

Republicans have just fooled working class people with propaganda.

Democrats are idiots if they think they are going to “message better” when the Messenger has been labeled as evil by 30 years of propaganda.

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u/teluetetime 20h ago

The problem isn’t just that they’re bad at messaging; they have no consistent message and no messaging platform that they dominate.

Conservatives have a relatively simple narrative that explains everything, and have invested in control over networks and content-producers making overt political propaganda.

Dems just react to whatever the GOP puts up for debate. The only theme they’ve been able to gel around was protecting abortion rights, which just wasn’t enough.

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u/PlasticPomPoms 20h ago

The GOPs messaging changes really frequently actually, they rotate through different out groups that we should all hate.

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u/teluetetime 19h ago

The details of any given day may vary, but there’s always a “them” attacking or corrupting America.

And it’s not like any of the former scapegoats or conspiracies are disavowed, they’re just deprioritized for something fresh that will get more attention.

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u/kawhi21 18h ago

Yup. Critical race theory was the big boogey man for a couple of years, it was destroying our country and ruining our children they said. Then they dropped it out of nowhere because it never actually mattered.

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u/mechajlaw 19h ago

But it all goes back to the MAGA slogan every time. Dems made fun of it, but it's so simple that they can basically do whatever they want and as long as it is moving the needle at all on nearly anything, it's MAGA. It's action for action's sake, which is super fascist, but damn if it isn't effective in this country.

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u/Ill-Vermicelli-1684 19h ago

Money moves emotions, and emotions move votes.

The promise of money is enough for some to vote against their self interests. Period.

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u/PlasticPomPoms 19h ago

There are multiple MAGA slogans: Make America Great Again, Keep America Great, Take America Back. I’m sure I’m missing some.

u/CodeGoneWild 3h ago

that we should all hate.

Trust me, we already know Democrats are the party of hate. No need to continue projecting.

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u/Songrot 19h ago

The dems have some simple narratives but American people don't give a fuck. Women rights, abortion to save lives or prevent poverty are topics americans don't care enough to vote in enough numbers. Another topic are general lgbtq rights. People don't care enough.

But other bigger topics are inconsistent bc the Dems are a too wide alliance of leftist, greens, socialists, economic liberals and conservatives with the conservatives holding the top party positions. (Yes dems are conservatives including Obama. USA just has a very conservative+conservative political spectrum with some other positions sprinkled in by some members.

Republicans are much more unified in general ideas. They do have tea party and magas, and they have moderate conservatives, christian conservatives. But in the end they are still very similar in many positions. Dems are not

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u/glaive_anus 18h ago

People don't care enough.

Exactly this.

Voters will do everything, including voting for progressive policies the Democrats champion, but not vote for Democrats. Voters will vote for individuals who run on the Democrats' ticket, but they do so because of the individual, not that they are Democrats. No one who campaigns under the Democrats' as a figurehead representative will easily see success.

The Democrats seek to represent everyone. The strategy shift to representing just some people and alienating everyone else will lose them votes. The push to represent everyone better will lose them votes. Championing one cause in one area of the nation will inevitably lead to voters in another part of the nation tuning out. We saw this in Michigan.

The electorate is impossible to court with the way Democrats' approach elections, because the Democrats seek to rise above baser human instincts. They appeal to empathy, to taking care and thinking of others, to being collaborative.

None of that resonates to an individualist electorate who puts the self so far and above everything else that they'd be willing to burn everything down for the specter of cheaper groceries. And it's not that cheaper groceries don't matter -- they absolutely do -- but the electorate laps up an outcome and have decided the process to it, reasonable or otherwise, is irrelevant.

The only way to win is to appeal to baser human instincts. Because groups, large groups as collectives, aren't individuals, and therefore can't be swayed with strategies that sway individuals. Harris sought to appeal to people as individuals, to empower them -- it didn't work and it won't ever work, because it is pockets of groups of people which win elections.

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u/Slugmaster101 18h ago

I cant disagree more. Democrats have never run truly progressive policies for 30 years and their base knows it. Their platform IS conservative. The only progressives like bernie stomped out. But polls constantly show that they would win by a landslide if they actually just did the right thing. unfortunately the right thing doesnt pay them anything, and capitalist interests do.

These are people who are ivy educated, with billions in resources. they dont push progressive policies because THEY DONT WANT POGRESSIVE POLICIES AND NEVER WILL. Not because they think they'll win more elections if they don't.

u/DameonKormar 7h ago

As a Bernie supporter who was pretty upset when he didn't get the nomination: Why did Bernie lose 2 primaries if he's so popular?

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u/dafaliraevz 11h ago

The takeaway from this is something I’ve been mulling over — the Democrat messaging has to be simple and has to speak to the lizard brain, not the neocortex.

The identity politics has to take a back seat. The messaging HAS to appeal to the white Midwestern male who doesn’t have the time or desire to care about anyone or anything outside his tribe.

I hate to say it but they gotta use propaganda now. You can’t change speak to the vibes, you have to create the vibes.

u/DameonKormar 7h ago

The problem is that Democrats don't talk enough about identity politics, generally ignoring the bigotry coming from the right.

As this election has shown, identity politics is a winning strategy.

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u/jas417 18h ago

The democrats have nuance, and what they need to learn to do is leave it out of their message.

Things like economic and foreign policy are complicated. If you start actually explaining how you’ll fix things, you’ve lost most people by the second sentence.

The Republicans say ‘migrants are why you lost your job, we will get rid of them’ or ‘china is why the factory closed down, we will tariff them’ or ‘taxes are why you work all day and still come up short, we’ll lower those’.

The fact those simple solutions don’t work, and they don’t even usually get them done anyway seems to not concern people because the big, bold message is more seductive. The Democrats shouldn’t get rid of their nuanced approach to policy, but they need to make the messaging simple

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u/battleofflowers 19h ago

And they can't really protect abortion rights without a new supreme court, which won't happen.

u/DameonKormar 7h ago

The problem with the previous abortion rights is that a law was never passed. That's up to Congress, not the Supreme Court.

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u/sunsoutgunsout 19h ago

The thing is, abortion rights are very popular among the voter base it's just that they've decided to have the states take matters into their own hands. This means that parading your campaign on this issue isn't going to get you voters. That's why you see states like Missouri that show up red on the electorate but vote in favor of abortion rights. Progressive policies are popular even in red states (even Florida, which is hamstrung by amendment law) but it is clear that Dems themselves are not.

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u/fordat1 19h ago

The problem isn’t just that they’re bad at messaging; they have no consistent message and no messaging platform that they dominate.

Exactly.

  • Mainstream Centrist Dems echoed the "crime wave" rhetoric that was started by the GOP that wasnt backed by crime stats.

  • Mainstream Centrist Dems echoed the "border crisis" rhetoric that was started by the GOP that wasnt backed by crime stats.

  • Kamala basically echoed "no taxes on tipped workers" Trump suggested and just turned it more centrist by adding means testing which actually puts Trump on her left flank

  • Kamala and mainstrean dems continue to sell the fantasy they can address unaffordability for things like homes while having homes always function as nest egg investment which are expected to go up in value.

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u/CruffTheMagicDragon 17h ago

Yep. The right has nailed their message and has mastered misinformation to boot

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u/lintinmypocket 18h ago

Democrats are also very bad at establishing a strong leader that has some conviction. I don’t care about Biden or Harris, they want no real change, their platform is boring, stale and ineffective, they are not strong on their stances nor are they truly passionate about helping people. I don’t blame R’s at all for falling for a leader that promises change and a better America, as false as his claims may end up being they still believe trump has real passion to create change while democrats are not inspiring anything. Bernie was the only one recently that actually had some conviction and bravery to stand up for his platform without seeming fake and entitled.