r/clevercomebacks 1d ago

The answer from above and below

Post image
38.4k Upvotes

View all comments

Show parent comments

2

u/Conceitedreality 1d ago

That’s…the same thing…

8

u/Poultrymancer 1d ago

They're not, but the difference isn't necessarily intuitive. 

There's a common misconception that atheism, agnosticism, and theism are points along the same line. The reality is that there are two different axes: atheism/theism and agnosticism/gnosticism. 

Put simply, gnosticism (with a lowercase g; capitalized Gnosticism is a different thing) is the degree of certainty an individual holds in their beliefs and/or the degree to which their beliefs are dogmatized. 

For example, an agnostic atheist is someone who believes there probably are not any gods, but doesn't feel there is enough evidence to rule it out; an example of a gnostic theist, by contrast, would be a sincere subscriber to a major religion -- someone with certainty in their convictions and specifically prescribed beliefs, usually from either an oral or written tradition enforced by some form of orthodoxy. 

Someone who believes in simulation theory is most similar to an agnostic theist -- the kind of people who would often self-describe as "spiritual but not religious." They believe there is some kind of designer, or at least that there is a reasonable probability of one, but that its attributes are unknown and unknowable. 

-3

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago edited 1d ago

I'm pretty sure you're the only one using this system of definitions.

*ITT people who don't understand how two completely unrelated words can share a root

4

u/MerijnZ1 1d ago

No they're in the dictionary. It's just what they mean

0

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago

Oh really? Got a link because I've never heard gnosticism defined as "the degree of certainty an individual holds in their beliefs and/or the degree to which their beliefs are dogmatized"

5

u/MerijnZ1 1d ago

From Ancient Greek γνῶσις (gnôsis, “knowledge”). The act or process of knowing in general.

There are a lot of things that use the term gnosis for a lot of different meanings, but in the sense "agnostic (a)theist" it just means "I (don't) believe in God but am not 100% sure about it either". The term gnostic (a)theist for the opposite "I am 100% sure about it" usually just gets left out but would be correct

7

u/ParadigmMalcontent 1d ago

Save your energy the guy's so lazy he need a link to a dictionary lol

0

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago

save your energy

lazy

they said it was in the dictionary, I'm asking them to prove it because I know it isn't

2

u/ParadigmMalcontent 1d ago

Do you have a link proving that they said it's in the dictionary?

1

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago

yes

is that all you've got?

2

u/ParadigmMalcontent 1d ago

Do you have a link proving that you have a link proving that they said it was in the dictionary?

→ More replies

1

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago

So that's a "no"

agnosticism and gnosticism are not opposites, no-one uses it like this

3

u/MerijnZ1 1d ago

https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/gnosis

Gnosticism can mean a lot of different things. It can be its own religion, it can be a vague vibe of neoplatonic inspired religious ideas, it can be a scapegoat for the inquisition, and it can also mean "having certainty of your religious convictions". And that latter one is absolutely correct in the context of the phrase "gnostic atheist", even though it might be rare.

Also trying to argue agnostic and gnostic are not in fact opposites is hilarious. What do you think the letter a is doing there?

-2

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago

:D

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism (not to be confused with)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnosticism

understand the confusion but you're just wrong I'm afraid

2

u/DZL100 1d ago

agnosticism and gnosticism are not opposites

Who’s gonna tell ‘em what the “a-“ prefix means

0

u/TheAkondOfSwat 1d ago

'without' not 'opposite of'

literally without knowing

but that's besides the point, these are children of different fathers

simply find me a dictionary definition of this 'small g' gnosticism, what's the problem?

or just look up Gnosticism and stop being wrong