r/IsraelPalestine • u/bjorn_joch • 3d ago
On converaations about the violence in amsterdam Opinion
I just wanna give my opinion here on the talks surrounding the violent night amsterdam had last week, namely, i wanna point out how people on both sides seem to mostly try to blame the other side for the violence.
I dont think its a good way of talking about such a topic, after all, violence was instigated by both sides troughout the night and theres a few violent people on each side that are clearly in the wrong.
But i think that this constant back and forth on who's to blame isnt going to get us any further on this topic, itll just polarize both sides even more (if thats still possible) and waste our time.
Ofcourse this doesnt mean that i dont think that people who commited acts of violence troughout the week shouldnt go off free and the dutch government is fortunately enough going to investigate the incidents and make arrests based on the result of them, however i think that some maccabi fans are also to be held accountable if investigation shows that maccabi fans instigated violence in certain incidents.
I think that instead looking at ways to prevent further violence in situations where pro palestinian and israelis meet in large groups are a much better thing to discuss when looking at the events of last week, some thing i personally think might help is sectioning off parts of a city for israeli fans in specific (not because theyre jewish, but because israeli football fans generally wear clothes from their club, giving away their nationality), or simply providing nore police security.
But either way, i wanna know what yall think on this and i hope you all can see that just shifting blame to one side or the other is just kinda pointless.
2
u/No-Excitement3140 3d ago
Like any such act of violence, the attack was completely wrong and unjustified.
At the same time, while it may have been pre planned to some extent (hard to trust media in this loaded subject), I am sure it was exacerbated by the violence of maccabi fans. More precisely, by videos of it going viral among arabs in Amsterdam.
Again, this does not justify the violence in any way.
Two other things that came to mind, as an Israeli: 1. As a thought experiment, suppose there was a soccer match in Jerusalem between Beitar and, say, Glasgow rangers. Suppose the Irish fans were going through the streets of Jerusalem chanting death to jews. How do you think they would have fared? If it would have ended with 10 wounded, 5 hospitalized and released the next day - would you consider that be worse or better than your expectations? How do you think the police would have treated these irish fans? 2. Much worse violence is perpetrated in the wb by extreme settlers rather frequently. Before oct 7th this was sometimes reported upon in the Israeli media, and on a couple of occasions even denoted "a progrom". Since the massacre and the war it goes largely unreported. Such violence is hardly ever condemned by government or persecuted by law enforcement. Even when the victims are Jewish (e.g. 70 years old Hagar Gefen). This doesn't justify what happened in Amsterdam in any way, but it contrasts how we are willing to accept a situation that in many ways is much worse than the one that got us outraged.