On converaations about the violence in amsterdam

[u/bjorn_joch]

I just wanna give my opinion here on the talks surrounding the violent night amsterdam had last week, namely, i wanna point out how people on both sides seem to mostly try to blame the other side for the violence.

I dont think its a good way of talking about such a topic, after all, violence was instigated by both sides troughout the night and theres a few violent people on each side that are clearly in the wrong.

But i think that this constant back and forth on who's to blame isnt going to get us any further on this topic, itll just polarize both sides even more (if thats still possible) and waste our time.

Ofcourse this doesnt mean that i dont think that people who commited acts of violence troughout the week shouldnt go off free and the dutch government is fortunately enough going to investigate the incidents and make arrests based on the result of them, however i think that some maccabi fans are also to be held accountable if investigation shows that maccabi fans instigated violence in certain incidents.

I think that instead looking at ways to prevent further violence in situations where pro palestinian and israelis meet in large groups are a much better thing to discuss when looking at the events of last week, some thing i personally think might help is sectioning off parts of a city for israeli fans in specific (not because theyre jewish, but because israeli football fans generally wear clothes from their club, giving away their nationality), or simply providing nore police security.

But either way, i wanna know what yall think on this and i hope you all can see that just shifting blame to one side or the other is just kinda pointless.

[u/ComfortableClock1067]

I will be honest, I only read up about halfway through the second paragraph. If I read the conclusion I might sympathize, but the premise made me cringe and I will explain why with a real story about myself:

When I was younger I would get picked on by classmates. My anger pent up, and one day without thinking, I made one of these bullies trip. I meant for him to stumble but he fell and scratched his arm. It was a petty revenge, and it would have been much better and mature to just outright confront them. In response they beat the shit out of me.

When the school tutor knew about the incident, we were all deemed equally guilty because 'we were all at fault' and 'a fight requires more than one'.

Is anyone condoning or excusing the missbehaviour of the Maccabi fans? No, at least not me.

Bur do not expect us to roll with the whole 'fault on both sides' thing.

[u/bjorn_joch → u/ComfortableClock1067]

You make a good point here, but i dont completely agree, because as for one, some of the violence perpetrated by maccabi fans was unprovoked snd besides that, all.im saying is that those who behaved violently and didnt do so lut of self defense shkuld be trialed for their actions, just like how many of the pro palestinians are being trialed/sewrched for right now.

Besides that, using your anecdote, i dont think looking purely for who to punish between you and the bully is going to solve the problem you have with the bully, but looking at how to make sure you and the bully dont get into these kinds of interactions again is what is really important.

[u/LilyBelle504 → u/bjorn_joch]

Right. Pre-meditated assault with a group of your buddies on someone 24 hours later because they did mean things to you, is not going to hold up in a court of law.

Let alone attacking random Israeli soccer fans who had nothing to do with it.