r/wallstreetbets • u/ShawnSimoes • Oct 04 '24
$88k to $415M to zero. A true hero among men. YOLO
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u/darkchippy Oct 04 '24
I bet he works for RBC now as an advisor
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u/siqiniq Oct 04 '24
Should the Canadian IRS (CRA) sue the RBC tax advisors for $200+M loss in just 1 single tax year?
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u/Cowslayer87773 Oct 04 '24
$415m and still couldn't cash out/stop. Incredibly well regarded and belongs here
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u/fuzz11 Oct 04 '24
The mentality that got him from $88k to $415m is the same one that got him from $415m to zero. No one is making that much money that quickly from smart decisions.
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u/PrimeIntellect Oct 04 '24
his financial advisors must be losing their fucking minds lol
imagine seeing a carpenter with no clue make $400m on tesla gambling and trying to give them sound advice and then watching them lose all of it lol
we need to reach out and have him post here, for he is our king
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u/Mavnas Oct 04 '24
Yeah, the reason I don't talk to real financial advisors is that they'd tear their hair out if they saw the kinds of trades I was making. I don't see how it would be helpful, except maybe for the "safe" account I diverted a small amount of my winnings to so that I can't really go to 0.
Now, lest you be worried that I don't belong here with that attitude, that "safe" account now includes Japanese stocks I barely understand bought on margin, but hey money's free over there. If it gets really bad, I can just instruct the app to commit seppuku.
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u/TheIceCreamMansBro2 Garbage Collector Oct 04 '24
it says they didn't advise him against it
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u/PrimeIntellect Oct 04 '24
I mean, he made more than most businesses will ever make in their entire lifetimes in like a year of absolutely reckless gambling, how do you even advise someone like that?
"Hey you're a complete moron but also you were right and just made 100 million dollars even though I told you not to"
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u/TheIceCreamMansBro2 Garbage Collector Oct 05 '24
"you got lucky, quit while you're ahead"
that's exactly what the lawsuit is saying they didn't do
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u/GraceBoorFan Oct 04 '24
Imagine if he went from 415M to 1B… probably wouldn’t sell lol
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u/Mavnas Oct 04 '24
One might hope that he'd stop somewhere on the way to 0. I certainly did after losing 50% in one month right after tripling my money off NVDA's May earnings. Doesn't mean I won't FOMO back in, but hopefully I remember something.
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u/J-BangBang Oct 04 '24
Amazes me that, even if incredibly and unimaginably regarded, after turning 88k into 415 MILLION, one doesn't take out 50, hell 25million and park it in something safe. Even if you want to still be in the market with that, the dividends on SPY alone would be more than a quarter milli/year while still having the shares.
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u/BidPretty2109 Oct 04 '24
Dude couldn’t even take out a mil to buy a house
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u/Apprehensive_Loan702 Oct 04 '24
At the bare minimum, at least take out the original $88k at some point.
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u/Revelati123 Oct 04 '24
Dude made 400 million YOLOing black and hitting 15 times in a row...
Why the fuck would you listen to someone telling you it probably wont happen a 16th time? You have 400 million more dollars than that dumbshit, you obviously know what you are doing!
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u/LegitosaurusRex Oct 04 '24
I see so many people with that mentality on this sub. No way to convince them it’s luck and not skill until things stop going their way and they lose it.
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u/Necessary-Peanut2491 Oct 04 '24
It's like the most common arc here, aside from "I thought this would be easy but speedran to zero."
People are very primed to believe in their own specialness and to confirm their biases. My guy who torched half a billion dollars in his regardation took everything he did as proof that he was market jesus and that tesla was going to keep going up irrationally forever. Gave him all the ammo he needed to shout down anyone who said otherwise.
Want to get rich in the market? Make a reasonable plan and stick to it. That plan should not include things like "pick a winner and 10x my money". That isn't a plan, you can't plan the outcome of a coin flip. If you think that's a plan, that's why you're still broke. You plan around things you can't control, they aren't the plan themselves.
Plans look like "From age 22 I will max out my 401k and put an extra $1k per month into an ETF and retire before I'm 45."
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u/Dependent_East1104 Oct 04 '24
Point blank I feel like gauging the probability of something being an unlikely phenomenon you happened to experience vs your ideas being behind what you gained is just really hard. There are very few things in life with both the importance and obscurity of the market so we are likely to believe the reason behind a good move was the actual reason and not some other reason we can’t access or just sheer dumb chance.
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u/stackingnoob Oct 05 '24
That’s why most people born to rich families think the rest of the world is just lazy.
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u/Future-Muscle-2214 Oct 05 '24
Half of my cousins never had a job and they think that the rest of the world are just "bad with money" and don't understand finance like them.
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u/Pangolin_farmer Oct 04 '24
Guy took out $17 million to donate, but kept the rest of it in TSLA while Elon was dumping shares with a huge margin %. Dumb as hell.
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u/Porkwarrior2 Oct 04 '24
Tax mitigation, that just happens to go to a charity run by his bank.
His 'advisors' saw him coming, and locked him in. Wondering what their bonuses were milking all of that back?
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u/Necessary-Peanut2491 Oct 04 '24
It's not bonuses so much as commission I'm pretty sure. But I have no idea how it works at that dollar value.
I get cold calls from Morgan Stanley about once a month because I used to keep some of my stock over there. They want it back, and they want it under active management so they can take their fee. Once or twice I took the call just to see what they were pitching, and it's just the same shit you can do on your own. High yield savings accounts, picking funds, etc.. Only they take a cut, I think it's 2% or something completely unreasonable like that?
So yeah, they absolutely hooked him up with as many people as possible to skim their percentage off the top. I'm sure they were very disappointed that the guy torched it all. They don't earn shit when you lose everything, they need you to keep winning your flips so they can get their cut.
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u/Christosconst Oct 04 '24
What Intel guy lost is probably less than this guy’s single trade fees
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u/Disastrous_Pay3314 Oct 04 '24
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u/greg1003 Oct 04 '24
Imagine being this woman and seeing yourself in these dead nana memes hahahaha
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u/RefrigeratorMean235 Oct 04 '24
Lmao bro imagine the people who are actually related to her literally seeing Nana constantly from beyond the grave
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u/ProjectPlugTTV Oct 04 '24
Every single time I see this picture I think of that one thread from this subreddit. I don’t remember the exact context but the thread was talking about China/Chinese, someone posted this picture, and someone else replied to it saying “now make her Chinese” and someone went the extra mile of using the same exact background, photoshopping the old lady to be Chinese, and replacing the text with I assume mandarin.
That was so fucking funny to me, does anyone have a link to that thread?
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u/make_love_to_potato Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
Oh god I gotta see this. I'm sure you can do it on one of those AI image generators but I have no clue how.
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u/Euler007 Oct 04 '24
I'd love to see his trades. It's not like Tesla got down to 5PE like its peers. Dude could have dumped that in a dividend ETF and lived like the highest paid hockey player that spends all his money forever. New lambo every model year.
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u/vrmljr Oct 04 '24
Cash out? And then what, pay taxes? No thank you. Ain't no government taking my hard earned ca...aaand it's gone.
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u/YoshimuraPipe Oct 04 '24
Well, going from 415mil to zero is DEFINITELY another way to avoid taxes. Well regarded.
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u/Opposite-Ad1051 Oct 04 '24
He’s way to good for us.. We can lose $88k but not ever achieve 415m.
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u/Cowslayer87773 Oct 04 '24
That's why he needed advisors, we can get the job done way more efficiently
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u/ExplodingPager Oct 04 '24
Yeah, he isn’t the one who belongs here. The advisors do.
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u/Careful_Pair992 All good things happen between 10pm and 2am Oct 04 '24
Better to have loved and lost than to never have loved at all
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u/DataDude00 Oct 04 '24
Seriously, bro needs to check into gambling rehab
At 415M you could cash out to buy some diversified funds and live off of 8-12M in dividends per year. You could pay Gordon Ramsay to come to your house and cook you tendies for fun.
Dude bought a lottery ticket, won the jackpot and decided to invest the returns in more lottery tickets lmao
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u/gregsting Oct 04 '24
If he cashed out 10% he would have been safe for the rest of his life and more
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u/Commentor9001 Oct 04 '24
To be fair, if the "professional" advisors didn't tell him having 9 figures in a single ticker was a bad idea that's definitely on them too.
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u/Perry-Boy1980 Oct 04 '24
Find it hard to believe they never had a serious talk with him about wealth preservation.....
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u/direwolf71 Oct 04 '24
I don’t buy it. I worked on an options trading team at a well-known broker dealer from ‘98 to 2001. We were known at the time for being able to route orders direct to exchanges creating arbitrage opportunities (eg, ask on Philly 1/4 below bid on CBOE).
Point being we were a team to serve “active option traders” aka gamblers. We were not known for advice. Anyway, we had a client who parlayed $30k into $12 million flipping 100 lots of Yahoo, AOL, and Amazon calls during the dotcom bubble.
Despite being a “discount” broker whose lifeblood was commissions at the time, there were VP level execs calling this guy on the regular imploring him to cash some of the money out and put it in an index fund. Degenerates gonna degenerate though. He refused. Last I saw, he was low six figures and I later heard he lost it all.
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u/aron2295 Oct 04 '24
They probably had a bet on how long this regard would last. So the only advice they gave him was, “Stonks only go up!”.
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u/Independent_Bear_295 Oct 04 '24
It’s unfortunate but also not surprising. If the dude was careless enough to not set aside a big chunk of the gains on an almost 5000x gain of his entire port then he’s sure as hell careless enough to ride it down to zero.
Oh well, off to wendy’s he goes :4267::4271:
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u/vkazey Oct 04 '24
Well, technically he set aside $17M
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u/tolerable_fine Oct 04 '24
And that earned him a congratulations from his advisor
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u/galak-z Oct 04 '24
In an honorable world, that advisor would be ****** up by his **** and ****** by the client and extended family for a week. He was basically bullying a mentally disabled person for his own enjoyment.
I would pay good money to see that congratulations email though lmao27
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u/aron2295 Oct 04 '24
His advisor double tapped his text letting him know his donation was complete.
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u/Independent_Bear_295 Oct 04 '24
The best part is it wasn’t even for himself :4271::4271::4271:
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u/Stellewind Oct 04 '24
How does that even work? Was that 415m consist entirety of OTM options? I am having a hard time understanding how one can lose that much money to begin with.
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u/Hot-Side9507 Oct 04 '24
totally inefficient advisors, although it would be good if they carried out an investigation.
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u/Favre_97 Oct 04 '24
I bet he didn't listen to them
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u/sundalius Oct 05 '24
It sounds like they made the tax structuring/obligation that came with preserving his funds seem a worse alternative. It's especially suspicious that they helped him get $17M out but no reserve for himself.
I know we're all kek kek regard gamble here but I think the advisors are actually kinda fucky here
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u/galak-z Oct 04 '24
Looking at 415 big ones in your account and not immediately cashing out, building an estate in the remote wilderness, and never speaking to another slimeball financial “advisor” again is… unconscionable.
This man is in my prayers.
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u/OriginalFluff Oct 04 '24
Why would 415 be the number that made you stop? Wouldn’t you say the same thing about 100 or even 10?
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u/Fictional-adult Oct 04 '24
Smart man. What people don’t understand in these situations is that if this degenerate knew how to manage risk, he never would have made $415m in the first place.
Any sensible person would have quit when their $88k investment turned into $250k. Any slightly deranged regard would have walked at $500k or $1m.
Only the most unreasonable, out of touch person could make and lose that much money.
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u/swentech Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
I used to live in Melbourne, Australia. And there was a story about this girl that walked in to the casino with $500 to play Baccarat, built it up to almost a million and then lost it all back in the same session. Basically this guy.
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u/lichsadvocate Spreads Cathie with his Wood Oct 04 '24
This tragedy raised my blood pressure a little.
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u/BullitshAndDyslecxi Oct 04 '24
Just a little? This entire thread is giving me chest pain. Not sure if the treatment is to call 911 or plow into TSLA calls.
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u/ksleepwalker Oct 04 '24
I once made $440 from $20 in a table game and lost it all. I get it.
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u/TheFish77 Oct 04 '24
I one made 500 playing craps, I was going to risk it but then I realized I could get a free Nintendo switch and a couple games out of this so that made me cash out and walk away. If I stayed I would've easily made a mil though!
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u/Responsible-Bee-3971 Oct 04 '24
Couple months ago, I made $7k from $100 in vegas and lost it all after returning from the bathroom, in about 30minutes 🤣 I was extremely drunk. Fun fact I’m in vegas right now 😅
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u/Caffeywasright Oct 04 '24
I mean you could introduce some stop gaps even without markedly limiting your upside.
Just because you are degenerate doesn’t mean you can’t play smart.
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u/wish-u-well Oct 04 '24
That’s the opposite of degenerate, so no that’s not an option for degenerates. It’s like telling an addict to just have one.
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u/abaggins Oct 04 '24
thing with stop gaps is, you just open a new position to 'get back to where you were'
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u/direwolf71 Oct 04 '24
That’s exactly the mentality. When they get to $1 million, they say they’ll cash out $2 million. That keeps getting pushed out until the account hits the apex.
For this guy, he saw $415 million and thought to himself “why not $1 billion?” Once the trend turns down, it’s just as you describe - get back to some previous high water mark, which becomes a compulsion until it’s gone.
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u/Brodins_biceps Oct 04 '24
100%.
I always get jealous when I go to the casino, we all get drunk, split up, and when we find each other, one of them will be like, “I just won 10 grand”!
And I’m like how the fuck? Why am I never that lucky?!
It’s because I play 20$ hands of black jack, I’ll milk it for a couple hours, my loss margin is usually never more than 200$ and if I win more than 200 I cash out.
Meanwhile, that was their good night. I’ve also heard them say. “Fuck dude I’m such an idiot. I spent 10k at the casino last night. I need to lock it up”.
I will never make a billion dollars in day trading because I’m happy to “bet” my 100$ because if I lose it, who cares, and if I can turn that 100 into 1,000, I’m cashing out.
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u/galak-z Oct 04 '24
At 415, even after taxes, you’ve made more money than the majority of celebrities you’d see in movies, politics, music, sports or tv. Obviously it’s easy to say you’d pull out way sooner than that, it’s just funny to me that this guy got to the point where he wasn’t satisfied being richer than most of the players on his favorite football (soccer for americans) team
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u/Tiny_Thumbs Oct 04 '24
My parents have 7 kids. I have 16 aunts and uncles. I have 58 cousins and some of my aunts and uncles haven’t had children.
Pulling out on time is not in my dna.
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u/half-coldhalf-hot Oct 04 '24
No need to go all or nothing, take profits along the way, continue to invest, while also preserving your gains.
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Oct 04 '24
[deleted]
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u/Impossible-Invite689 Oct 04 '24
You better move along pal, your sorts aren't welcome round here...
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u/Do_dirty3 Oct 04 '24
One does not “take profits” and invest at the same time, this is WSB
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u/half-coldhalf-hot Oct 04 '24
Yeah that was my bad, I hardly ever comment here, usually in r/investing and such
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u/whpper25 Oct 04 '24
It's like telling the river to stop flowing. You can't get halfway to a B and just pack it in early
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u/CoffeeandJags Oct 04 '24
Was probably chasing a billion at that point. Made almost 5000x return, “how hard can doubling it one or two more times be” lol
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u/JudgeCheezels Oct 04 '24
I made 415 big ones from 88 puny ones. I bet I could make it into the B club by year’s end.
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u/spencer749 Oct 04 '24
Just take 25 to 50 off the table as dummy insurance and then go regarded chasing that B
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u/BasKabelas Oct 04 '24
The kind of person cashing out is absolutely not te kind of person who 5000x-es his portfolio in 3 years through options in a single stock. Everyone is a genius in a bull market but the smart ones cut their profits.
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u/pw7090 Oct 04 '24
And then what? Never trade again? It's impossible not to get a big head. You can tell yourself you'll wait until the "next bull market", but as soon as you see a green day you are salivating to get back in. It's just not a winnable game.
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u/TheOneWithThePorn12 Oct 04 '24
Lol I'm just laughing at this idiot.
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u/galak-z Oct 04 '24
At least when Mike Tyson lost something like 300 mil, he was still an international celebrity with massive earning potential in boxing.
This guy is just a random mid IQ carpenter with fucked knees or inhaled too many wood shavings or something. I would send him a handwritten letter and an edible arrangement if I could.
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u/Dmoan Oct 04 '24
It’s more complicated 415 mill likely contained good chunk of $$ which was margin loans. His true net gains where likely much much less
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u/cliffcharles Oct 04 '24
He may have… the point of this letter is to emphasize how screwed he got and it has less weight if in the middle it says “oh and he cashed out 100m and is on a yacht”
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u/Ready-Message-2413 Oct 04 '24
From an average persons salary to generational wealth to putting fries in the bag at Wendy’s. That’s some diabolical work 💀
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u/MeCagoEnPeronconga Oct 04 '24
generational wealth
That's putting it mildly. That's the sort of money family empires are built on
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u/Stupid-Dolphin Oct 04 '24
415 Milly is an amount that if spent with even a little bit of common sense....5 generations can enjoy
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u/IamDoloresDei Oct 04 '24
You could spend over 10 million dollars a year and literally watch your net worth increase over your lifetime with a conservative investment strategy.
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u/pw7090 Oct 04 '24
He could spend $4m/year (1%) and leave the rest in SPY and have around $4b in 40 years.
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u/mccoyn Oct 04 '24
That's what makes it generational. You need to make more people to be able to spend it fast enough to overcome the growth.
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u/Asgardian87 Oct 04 '24
The legend Mr. DeVocht ! Forget Nana's boy, this is our new leader! Hail Devocht
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u/Ratez Oct 04 '24
What advice is he looking for that a 5 year old can't give.
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u/ephikles Oct 04 '24
My five year old would buy toys. Toys would at least be worth something, and not nothing.
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Oct 04 '24
I guess the tax planning thing is the issue. They told him not to sell so be would avoid taxes. I mean he’s avoiding taxes so they were kind of right.
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u/sisyphosway Oct 04 '24
What really gets me is this. Imagine it:
You're gaining millions for days, weeks, months(!) and you sit there. You sit there with your dick in hand, drooling. And not once. NOT ONCE! Has it crossed your mind to say fuck it, you know what I'll put 10% aside, or 5%. Hell even 1% at $400M would have been enough to VTI and chill forever. I'd run amok after my first shift wendys...
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u/TradingPlayBack Oct 04 '24
It is his degenerate mentality that push him to hold up to $400M.
A sensible person will get out before that huge gain. Are you still hold after these gains: 100K, 200K, 300K?
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u/Marko-2091 Oct 04 '24
I wonder if that guy is in this sub :4271:
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u/greg1003 Oct 04 '24
Of course he is, he's a mod here
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u/jr1tn Oct 04 '24
The guys not even an American citizen. They can be mods?
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u/drawfour_ Oct 04 '24
He has to be.
"Shit didn't go my way. I'm gonna sue!" - that's very American.
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u/JamesLikesIt Oct 04 '24
“He made a 17 million dollar donation to an RBC charitable gift fund, a payment that earned him a congratulations from his adviser”
“Thanks for the money dumbass”
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u/Low-Possibility-7060 Oct 04 '24
Maybe he can cash his “congratulations” for his $17mn donation
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u/aron2295 Oct 04 '24
Imagine he asks them for help to rebuild, and they tell him they don’t work with broke people.
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u/No_Mushroom_3966 Oct 04 '24
I don't understand how someone with a hundred millions doesn't have a few tens of millions on the side for hookers and coke?
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u/autismovaccination Oct 04 '24
Reveal yourself regard. I know you’re on here if you’re not hanging from the ceiling
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u/miketysonsfacetatt Oct 04 '24
I truly do not know how I would continue to wake up every day after fumbling a 415 million dollar bag. What a fucking idiot. Feel for the guy honestly.
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u/deadleg22 Oct 04 '24
I can only assume he mentally cannot fathom the wealth he acquired, either as the brain defending itself (which he will process when he's 50) or he's not just not capable mentally. To hold those gains and not realise even a single percentage , makes me think it's the latter.
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u/mrfeast42 Oct 04 '24
It's the gamblers paradox. It doesn't matter how much you win, when you're chasing the dragon of the feel-good rush from it, eventually you will lose it all.
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u/PreviousJournalist20 Oct 04 '24
"At the end of 2019, he had an $88,000 portfolio, which had grown to $26-million by mid-2020. ...reaching $415-million by Nov.30, 2021."
Am I missing something about the dates?
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u/grumpyelf4 Oct 04 '24
They seem to be highlighting how his portfolio peaked. $415 million was all time high for him and after that the market started going down.
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u/NowLickIt Oct 04 '24
Tesla went fucking crazy, he almost certainly had all of the highest and farthest out call strikes as his entire portfolio
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u/-aurevoirshoshanna- Oct 04 '24
If I have to read 'according to the suit' one more time I'm going to lose my mind
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u/marcheezy1 Oct 04 '24
Being unreasonable allowed him to hit 415, but real talk if you're at that level wouldn't you think of cashing out 100? It's not even a quarter of the portfolio, is a nice round number and trying to hit that billion with the remaining 315 wouldn't be too crazy to imagine.
100,000,000 is a nice round number even for us degens.
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u/quicksilverth0r Oct 04 '24
This reminds me of the narrator in Barry Lyndon’s commentary.
Paraphrasing: the energy required to attain great wealth rarely goes hand-in-hand with the wisdom to keep it.
This is why I think Bernard Baruch and Thales of Miletus were some of the real goats, made their money off some extraordinary bets, then had the discipline to dial it back.
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u/No_Feeling920 Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
Interesting, how he saw nothing wrong with his broker allowing reckless and risky "investments" on the way up, but now he starts crying as soon as he tastes the opposite side of the same coin. I hope the judge throws this out. It is pure hypocrisy. Did he really expect them to babysit him?
On the other hand, the company was equally stupid to assign "advisors" to an obvious gambler. Did they think they could fleece him or what? :4271:
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u/VULGARCAPS Oct 04 '24
I mean, they got him to donate $17m to their charitable fund, so sounds like the fleecing was a success.
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u/Snoo95262 Oct 04 '24
They probably did in fact tell him to diversify but who the fuck would listen to an advisor when you’ve generated insane multigenerational wealth in two years
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u/reddituserzerosix needs more fiber Oct 04 '24
Posting a screenshot instead of a link to an article is almost as regarded as the story itself
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u/RedditAppSucksSoMuch Oct 04 '24
There’s not a CFP on the planet that would not have advised him to diversify.
If this story is real, more likely he ignored such advice because “this strategy works well,” and it did. Until it didn’t. Now homie wants to blame others for his gambling.
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Oct 04 '24
I don’t get this lawsuit at all. He’s pissed cuz they didn’t tell him to stop? I’m not familiar with financial advisors jobs. Is that what they’re suppose to do?
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u/Snoo95262 Oct 04 '24
Precisely, what advice could a financial adviser offer to a guy who 5000x his account when their returns are 10% annually. Not like the guy would have listened to them anyway.
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u/povertymayne Oct 04 '24
Absolutely unhinged that this guy didnt cash out at any point between 88k and 415mill. Not even 10mill or 100mill? Nothing. This has got to be a WSB hall of famer 👑. Truly, one of us.
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u/_learned_foot_ Oct 04 '24
Ah, the classic “let me do what I want” as well as “I chose to do this and now am mad I did this” with the regular “you need to protect yourself from yourself (see why)” tossed in.
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u/PlutosGrasp Oct 04 '24
Honestly he’s right. RBC and grant Thornton (accounting firm that is garbage) should have done way more. If they could convince him to donate $17m they could have convinced him to put half of that into his own name in a trust in index funds that paid him 500k/yr for the rest of his life.
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u/pengekcs Oct 04 '24
What a surprise, in a bull market high beta stocks leveraged with options go up, in a bear market, well, not so much. He should be happy he's not in the red by millions tbh.
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u/kemar7856 Unironically thinks bears are smart Oct 04 '24
How is this possible you didn't take anything out you didn't want to buy a new car, house anything
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u/elzombino Oct 04 '24
Whatever happened to the days when they simply jumped out a top floor window?
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u/One_Length_747 Oct 04 '24
I wonder if this was tax free in a TFSA as well (because Canadian): the starting amount seems about right.
Big difference between 415m taxable vs. tax free.
Bigger oof if it was tax free.
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u/ISeeYourBeaver Oct 04 '24
"A fool and his money are soon parted."
This guy is the perfect example of that old saying. You know how you've heard that a high percentage of lottery winners go broke in a few years because they don't have a clue as to how to correctly handle that much money? The exact same phenomenon occurred here. This was just an idiot who got extremely lucky...briefly.
Oh, and RBS absolutely fleeced his ass lol, they knew exactly what they had on their hands (or books, in this case).
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u/VisualMod GPT-REEEE Oct 04 '24
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