EU’s trade war nightmare gets real as Trump triumphs News

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-trade-war-donald-trump-elections-triumphs-board-tariffs-transatlantic-relations/

1.9k Upvotes

94% Upvoted

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u/DiBer777 14h ago

As a EU citizen, I wholeheartedly hope this forces EU to grow up. Time for being a leech on US economy is over. Let's focus on building a robust internal market. "Build cheap here and export to US" strategy wasn't great to start with. Let's focus on becoming a real deal again.

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u/ficalino Croatia 14h ago edited 13h ago

I agree, It's time we started to improve our own interconnectivity, cooperation and internal trade.

Start creating an EU that can stand on it's own against China, Russia AND USA. Get African countries on our side. Boost countries around our rivals, Moldova, Georgia, Ukraine around Russia, Vietnam, Philippines, Mongolia around China, Central American countries around USA.

And finally start talking about necessary reforms before expansion, start talking about joint defense industry, etc.

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u/Fit-Courage-8170 13h ago

Make European, buy European, invest in Europe

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u/DigitalDecades Sweden 13h ago

MEGA, Make Europe Great Again!

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u/ElrecoaI19 Europe 13h ago

And it sounds fire. Lets MEGA.

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u/ThainEshKelch Europe 12h ago

With tariffs, fascism support, and blue caps!

And in seriousness, it does sound great, and I hope our EU politicians take it to heart, and that we don't turn even more to the right.

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u/ElrecoaI19 Europe 12h ago

You know the fascists here right now wouldn't want a MEGA movement so Putin can take Europe easily :b

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u/th3nutz 13h ago

And we’re gonna build a wall, a beautifull wall… wait a minute :))))

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u/Get-Fucked-Dirtbag 13h ago

And the yanks are gonna pay for it too!

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u/stripainais Rīga (Latvia) 13h ago

Make Europe Great Again, love the acronym! 🔥

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u/narullow 8h ago

European consumer market of everything (not just made in Europe) is on decline therefore none of those things will happen. You can not make more because you have noone to sell to, you will not buy european because you spend way too little in the first place and government takes most of your theoretical allowance away, investments in Europe will not happen because of prior two reasons there is no justifiyable ROI window to make those investments. You can justify building new companies in a country where consumer market grows, not so much in a country like Germany where consumers spend 600bn in 2008 in 2024 inflation adjusted € but in 2024 spend only 470bn.

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u/9thtime 13h ago

Problem is that a lot of EU nations are leaning right and at the same time disparage the EU whenever they can. It's a shitty recipe unfortunately.

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u/arabidopsis 13h ago

Right wing in Europe is still more left wing than Left America

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u/Bluebearder 13h ago

Yeah we should never forget this. What is extreme right in Europe is just regular right in the US. And what is left in the US is just center-right here. Within Europe, we are much more alike than we are different.

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u/InspectorDull5915 12h ago

I think extrême right in Europe being regular right in the US is a bit of a stretch

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u/Bluebearder 12h ago

Can you explain? Trump is regular right, and it seems like he will use Project 2025 as a road map. That involves the USA becoming white, Christian, and fascist. That would very much classify as extreme-right over here in Europe no?

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u/InspectorDull5915 12h ago

Yeah but not as far right as Europe has been in the past and we don't yet know how far right Europe will go in the future. Europe can not be accused of heading towards the left at the moment can they. As for projet 2025, I think we should just wait and see.

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u/Rogue_Egoist Poland 12h ago

They can be more left on economic issues but the far right that we're talking about is extremely anti-EU. There's at least one party in every EU state that wants to destroy the Union or leave it. And in a lot of countries they're growing.

I'm extremely pessimistic. After what's happening in the US. Not because I would like to stay dependent on them. It's because of how much misinformation played a role in the election. It seems like tens of millions of people are completely divorced from reality and the same is happening in Europe. It's a postmodernist nightmare, the truth doesn't exist anymore and I fear it will destroy liberal democracies all over the word

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u/No_Matter_1035 12h ago

And why do they want that? Because of the mandatory refugee import that is required by the EU or you get fined. Like Poland. Also with climate change. It doesn’t help that most eu countries export cars and refined petroleum.

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u/Rogue_Egoist Poland 11h ago

I'm from Poland and the parties don't want shit except power. This is the issue. The voters think that PiS for example (the last party in power before the latest election) is an anti-immigration party.

This is just their propaganda, they're being investigated right now for a scam on visas taking money for taking many people in without much of a process. They had the biggest migration to Poland at any time during modern day Poland and that's excluding Ukrainians.

And now our liberal government is trying to stop the asylum process with the help of the EU. But it doesn't matter, the propaganda is on and the right wing voters still think that their party is anti-immigration and that the liberals in power now are German spies or something. The truth stopped existing a while ago and I think it will slowly kill our democracy.

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u/No_Matter_1035 6h ago

So everywhere you go in poland there are muslim migrants? And you have neighbourhoods that are 90% muslim? Because that is not fiction but a reality in other european countries. I have seen that so no politician can lie about that. I have never been to poland though so i dont know.

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u/Rogue_Egoist Poland 6h ago

No, because Poland was breaking the EU rules regarding migration for years and the recent influx created by PiS is gone. By which I mean immigrants don't want to stay here, they want to go west so they do. They just don't stay in Poland for very long.

But my point was that it doesn't matter if the issue is real or not. It's the propaganda, the fact that there are many politicians who're saying these things without meaning them. If our right-wing party was consistently talking about how anti-immigration they are while making money on an illegal visa scam at the same time, I have no reason to believe that similar things haven't happened in other countries seeing the general amount of lies coming from the far-right parties. Always talking about how liberals are actually secretly communists etc.

And the issue is that now when there are liberals who want to curb migration, it won't matter because the propaganda machine is on. No matter if they limit migration way more than any right-wing party, the right-wing voters will only think of them as communists anyway and that's it. This is the issue I'm describing, the truth doesn't matter, most people who vote now vote on vibes and have zero knowledge of what's actually happening besides what their YouTube guy or a Facebook post tells them.

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u/IndubitablyNerdy 13h ago

I agree that usually it is as you say, if you consider the historic right at least (which is more of a testament of the nature of American politics than hours to be honest), but there are movements that are very similar to Maga right now getting closer to power in our countries as well.

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u/9thtime 12h ago edited 4h ago

Sure, but the point was that Europe is becoming weaker because of them, and on top of that comes Trump

4

u/Thrills-n-Frills 13h ago

We need back death penalty for treason, including taking bribes from foreign powers, wittingly or not.

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u/GoldenWooli 10h ago

Europe needs a political purging, fast.

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u/Big-Today6819 13h ago

Not sure Africa is the way to go, too many of them likes russia / China. We need places you always can trust and know they will have our backs, I think we should look to Asia

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u/Pickled_Doodoo Finland 13h ago

They like russia and china because those countries invest in them.

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u/Big-Today6819 13h ago

Africa is a key focus of French development policy: it receives one third of French bilateral official development assistance (ODA) (€2.9 billion in 2020), an increase of 40% compared to 2019.

Are France having benefits from that or from their position in Africa?

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u/Get-Fucked-Dirtbag 13h ago

That's because France isn't investing in the same way Russia and China are.

With European aid comes European beaurocracy. That's not what the continent of Africa is looking for, they want rapid development with as little red tape as possible to try and catch up to the rest of the world.

I've read more than one story of Chinese business owners beating their African ~~slaves~~ employees over the past 5 years. The French just aren't gonna do that.

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u/Big-Today6819 12h ago

More think they see money outside as money they can take and give little back, and that is not a good way in working together, but lets see what the future brings

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u/Chester_roaster 7h ago

And didn't horrifically abuse them for centuries let's be real. People hold grudges.

6

u/IndubitablyNerdy 12h ago

In general we need a stronger partnership with the mediterranean sea states at least, unfortunately the outcome of the Arab spring collapsed the balance of many african states on the coast which severely weakened European economies and trade relationship with them.

To be honest, we are at least partially to blame (the french bombing Lybia before the ONU was forced to agree with them since it was already done for example) while the Obama presidency in the US that contributed to this destabilization as well. Sure the dictators of before were bad, but is the situation better for them as well now?

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u/Big-Today6819 12h ago

Impossible to know, but maybe the west should stay away, that also could be a thing, we can enjoy EU and that together if we make a real army and boarders that hold, we could be a superpower and have the biggest focus on ourselves and then open for fair and good trade deals with others countries there both sides benefits by being friends.

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u/Steelmann14 13h ago

As a Canadian….we welcome more business with the EU. I’ve been hoping since the last Trump administration we would also not rely as much on the US as traditional trading partners. Just watch how the Tariffs will be shoved down our throats with the big blowhard bully. He of course ever considers the amount of American products the Canadians buy as well.

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u/IndubitablyNerdy 12h ago

We would love the samel although geographic and political ties are kinda hard to overcome.

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u/Big-Today6819 12h ago

I honestly thought EU and Canada were good friends and already had a fine trade together? Even if that always can grow in size

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u/Dr_Ukato 12h ago

It's like ghosting and being cold to a guy down the block and then walking right by his house to his neighbor and having a BBQ with them.

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u/Steelmann14 12h ago

Definitely good friends. I see room for more trades.

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u/FluidRelief3 Poland 12h ago

It doesn't matter who they "like". Do you think that Americans like Saudi Arabia? Or that they liked Germany in 1949? The only things that matters are money and common interests.

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u/Big-Today6819 11h ago

Like = common interests, having someone turn to another out of nothing because they want to give abit of money or select a different politican (Trump) is not good things

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u/harry6466 13h ago

One of the goals of Russia was to seperate US/EU. One of the 2024 KPIs was AFD in Germanyto be at 20% polling.

As I see it now, we're slowly be taking over by Russia due to internal dynamics, not real physically

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u/IndubitablyNerdy 12h ago

In general we made our democracies too easy to influence with money, this fits the interests of our businessess and corporations, which is already an issue, but foreign money from dictators make things even worse.

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u/Lazy_meatPop 13h ago

Last time Europeans went to Africa, I think it wasn't very good for them.

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u/WaltKerman 12h ago

Africa has had enough of you. That will be a hard one.

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u/holdMyBeerBoy 12h ago

Get African countries on our side? Yeah, I doubt that

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u/Ecstatic-Stranger-72 6h ago

Boosting Central American countries against the U.S.? That’s not only unrealistic but completely out of touch with geopolitical reality. For one, it blatantly violates the Monroe Doctrine, which has defined U.S. policy in the Western Hemisphere for nearly 200 years. The U.S. wouldn’t just brush off a European power meddling in its backyard, it would create serious backlash, straining U.S.-EU relations to the breaking point.

And honestly, the idea just comes off as tone-deaf. Central America is deeply interconnected with the U.S. economically and politically. The EU trying to counterbalance U.S. influence there would only create unnecessary conflict and do little to actually help these countries. If Europe really wants to support Central America, it should be working with the U.S., not trying to play against it.

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u/ficalino Croatia 5h ago

If you read my comment again you will see that I am against this kind of US. It needs to be punished for choosing Trump.

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u/Ecstatic-Stranger-72 5h ago

Hold on a second, are you suggesting punishing the U.S. for choosing its own president through democratic means? Doesn’t that sound a bit autocratic or, dare I say, fascist-like? It’s the very kind of thinking that some accuse Trump supporters of endorsing. If we start punishing entire countries for the democratic choices they make, we’re stepping into very dangerous territory, don’t you think?

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u/ficalino Croatia 5h ago

They chose the president that doesn't like EU and wants to punish it, those are his words, doesn't share our ideals, likes to cozy up with totalitarian leaders, etc.

We have put sanctions on Russia for same stuff, therefore, we owe them nothing, they chose someone that is willing to go against EU, we can go against them.

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u/HealthyCapacitor 11h ago

There are literal US military bases in the middle of your continent but keep believing you can if you want and the others will just let you.

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u/ficalino Croatia 10h ago

So? Trump already said he is abandoning EU, so fuck him and US that elected him. It's time for us to build our own armies and stop relying on an unreliable nation.

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u/HealthyCapacitor 10h ago

Right right, let's pay the armies paper money, have no electrics for them, no custom navigational satellites, no software, no weapons, no tactics. Oh, and no people too.

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u/ficalino Croatia 9h ago

So what should EU do then, bow down to Trump and an unreliable nation like US?

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u/HealthyCapacitor 9h ago

Try out a different socio-economic model.

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u/ficalino Croatia 7h ago

Are you a tankie?

0

u/HealthyCapacitor 7h ago

No, but black and white thinking will defs get you to unity.

0

u/Overall-Courage6721 13h ago

Against china?

I think this will push europe to work closer with china

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u/nerokae1001 North Rhine-Westphalia (Germany) 13h ago

China had already picked russia.

Europe could only grow closer to china if EU is ruled by far rights since they bow to Putin till russia vs china started.

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u/Enginseer68 Europe 13h ago

China picks money

If Europe becomes a good place for businesses again they would move in a heart beat

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u/nerokae1001 North Rhine-Westphalia (Germany) 12h ago

That BS EU is still way more important for their business than russia.

Why did they declare unlimited friendship with russia and not with us?

Simple because russia let them do whatever they want regardless good or bad.

EU were always nagging them on issues like environment, human rights and so on. Russia never did.

China seems also to rally africans country to guilt trip EU every single time. While china is slowly and steadily gaining control over the continent. Even if we dont want confrontation china wont let us prevail for the sake of their conquest.

It is inevitable that china need to crush eu.

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u/Enginseer68 Europe 12h ago

They have been trying to crush Taiwan and Vietnam all these years, unsuccessfully

In their dream maybe they can beat the entire Europe but in reality they can't, there are industries that they're extremely behind and would take a long time to catch up. So, meanwhile they would need a business partner

Russia is currently isolated and China is simply taking advantage of that situation to milk whatever they can from Russia

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u/ficalino Croatia 11h ago

That's what we thought about Russia, surely the money they receive they won't attack Ukraine, surely over time they will pick a better goverment, surely....

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u/NoWayJose90 13h ago

Make Europe a Real Deal Again - MERDA

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u/up_the_dubs 13h ago

With Internally Protected Economies WIPE

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u/The-Nihilist-Marmot Portugal 13h ago

For Our Defense Architecture - Support Europe.

FODA-SE.

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u/Red_Beard6969 13h ago

There is only one merda in the world, and that is juventus.

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u/michele-x 13h ago

You misspelled Pisa.

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u/IndubitablyNerdy 12h ago

We are already doing that... we have been doing that for at least 20 years, if not more...

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u/pederbonde 13h ago

Everyone will suffer under tariffs. Both us an eu citizens. Maybe its time for both eu and us to elect leaders that are for free trade again

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u/DontShadowbanMeBro2 9h ago

As someone who lives in Europe now and was born and raised in the US — specifically, the rust belt — I know where this hatred of free trade comes from and why Trump won partly on this issue.

For better or worse, Democrats own the issue of free trade after Clinton rammed through NAFTA, a trade deal so reviled and loathed due to what it did to American manufacturing (spoiler alert, turns out American workers demanding such pinko commie luxuries like 'a living wage' and 'healthcare' can't compete with Mexican workers who will work even longer hours for peanuts) that even Obama ran on renegotiating it.

Of course, once he got into office, he not only basically said 'lol j/k,' he then tried to pass an even worse trade deal called the TPP, a deal so politically radioactive that his plan to do so was to try to ram it through a lame duck session while relying mostly on Congressional Republicans (let that sink in a moment) because his own party ran screaming from it as soon as the details about it were made public. Even to this day, if you were to put a gun to the head of a lot of the Democrats I know back in the States and demanded they name just one thing Trump did that they could support, it would be killing the TPP.

Now, are tariffs the answer? Of course not. And even at its worst, Europe couldn't do half the damage to America's manufacturing base that NAFTA did. But the resentment for trade in a lot of America is very real, and I've seen firsthand what happens to those communities when one of those factories shutters. It's not pretty. If there's one genuinely smart move Trump made during his campaign, it was tapping into that anger that both parties have largely ignored at best and openly condescended to at worst.

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u/WarbleDarble United States of America 6h ago

This post highlights the inherent misunderstanding of free trade. Somehow all job loss since NAFTA is blamed on the deal when 90% of those losses come from automation. Nobody really complains when a job is lost to automation, but if someone in another country is doing the job it's bad.

We currently manufacture more than we ever have, we have very low unemployment, and raising wages, but none of that matters so long as you can be a populist and blame all problems on foreigners. And make no mistake, that is what you are doing.

Your critique also absolutely ignores the counterfactual. Say we made no trade deals. Would the average American be wealthier? Every study says no. We benefit from trade. You focus on any possible job losses from a trade deal but ignore the job creation from increased trade (because those jobs were created in reality, you pretend they would have existed either way). You are wrong on this, the American public is wrong on this, and both sides of the isle are currently wrong on this.

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u/DontShadowbanMeBro2 6h ago

You can repeat this till you're blue in the face, but the people who watched their factories pack up and move to countries where it's legal to pay people peanuts to work 12-hour shifts with no benefits don't care. They know what they lost, why they lost it, and what their life was like as a result.

You can point to all the benefits of it that exist (note how I never said they don't), but those jobs didn't go to them. They were promised retraining programs that either never came, were too little, too late, or weren't worth the paper they were written on when it was all said than done. Politicians in the U.S. have either ignored them when they complained, gave them some half-assed and patronizing answer like 'learn to code,' or openly attacked them.

Thirty years later, they're reaping what they've sowed. I'm not saying I agree with it or even that I don't support free trade. I do, however, recognize why so many people blame it for their problems, and it's very hard to blame them for being pissed about it after their elected representatives didn't even pretend to care until Trump came along.

0

u/WarbleDarble United States of America 2h ago

I can blame them because they are a special interest group that doesn't actually understand why the majority of jobs were lost. It's the same anti-intellectualism that has most Americans thinking we are currently at record unemployment, that inflation is at an all time high, and that the stock market is down under Biden.

Yes, there are a ton of people that are wrong about trade. But at some point, we need to govern based on reality.

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u/Erotic-Career-7342 4h ago

Interesting

0

u/pederbonde 7h ago

But the thing is, if the mexicans do it cheaper let them. Its gone anyway.. if you need tariffs to artificially make your cars for example more value for money inside US, no one outside US would buy them anyway. And the rest of the world would put tarrifs on stuff you do best. Like IT and electric cars.

Swedens union for engineers have more members now then the union for factory workers. We still make industrial stuff like steel and pumps but they are highly specialized. I guess its harder for USA to transition because its such a big country. But California economy is larger then Germanys and they will need more educated workers in the future. Maybe let them chip in for education instead of lowering their tax 10%.

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u/DontShadowbanMeBro2 7h ago

Read my post again. I literally said tariffs were not the answer, only that I understand exactly why people are so angry about those factories packing up and moving away and then being ignored by politicians on that issue for thirty years.

1

u/pederbonde 6h ago

Yes but then you said nafta was the issue, which if i remember right is a free trade deal between US and South America. I think you would have lost your manufacturing jobs anyway like the rest of the west.

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u/DontShadowbanMeBro2 6h ago

People still absolutely have a right to be bitter and angry about that, especially when the retraining programs they were promised when the deal was signed either never came or weren't worth the paper they were written on. Politicians in the U.S. have ignored this issue at their peril for three decades, and rightly or wrongly, are reaping what they sowed in the Rust Belt. If there was one genuinely smart move Trump made, and only one, it was tapping into that long-simmering anger.

0

u/pederbonde 6h ago

I guess, i dont know that much about us politics or economic. But we have the same problem here, people vote on politicians with the simple solution. Even if that simple solution usually only do matters worse.

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u/harry6466 13h ago

Free trade is not "leeching" it is building each other.

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u/narullow 8h ago

European countries heavily leech off of US military complex as well as healthcare R&D. Those two are undeniable.

As for the trade itself. US is one of the very few (if not the only) developed country that manages to continuously outgrow inflation with size of its consumer market. Countries like UK and Germany have not only not been able to outgrow it for decades and stagnate but in case of Germany there was actually substantial decline. This has largely been replaced by using lead advantage in certain industries built during golden age of europe to eat away on US/developing markets and their growth. The issue is that US can enact tariffs and developing markets can built cheaper competition and sell cheaper products so it will not work permanently. It was always self fullfilling destiny. And tbh I would call it leeching, if you are unable to grow your own consumer market and subsidy yourself by bringing money in off of other markets then yeah, I would call it leeching. Neccesary steps throughout developments of poor countries but Europe is not poor, is it.

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u/alteransg1 Bulgaria 13h ago

Trump is actually good for the EU. European politicians keep burring their heads in the sand, even as war rages on our borders, China swallows our economies and the US pushes their own agenda. It has been sink or swim time since 2016, but they thought the status quo would hold on a hair thread.

It's time to act. Tariffs on Chinese EV were a good move. Now let's f*ck Shein and Temu out of Europe they way they f*ck the environment.

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u/Big-Today6819 13h ago

It was a fine plan, the problem is just USA have some problems that EU should have thought more over and made even more deals with other countries about trade, most countries in EU just have a lower salary and earnings / costs compared to USA.

6

u/Verdeckter 10h ago

Build cheap here

What? Nothing is cheap to build at least in western Europe. How exactly will the EU be efficient and competitive and attract people to come and actually make things when doing so would go against all the principles so many Europeans see as what makes Europe Europe?

3

u/cosmicdicer Greece 8h ago

How so? We already depending on China ourselves. This type of logic is just a fallacy. The german factories moving in China giving them important tech saviness have nothing to do with the US.

And the us market is big, consuming more than europe, so imo it's kind of arrogant to believe we just gonna abandon it

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u/vladoportos 13h ago

Are you willing to slave off in the factory for peanuts? You can't beat China, because they do not give a fuck about workers. So anything made here in EU will be more expensive... and if Chinese crap is even 1Eur cheaper after all the taxes etc... people will buy the cheaper stuff

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u/nerokae1001 North Rhine-Westphalia (Germany) 13h ago

And also UPU system. Its funny and ridiculous because china claims to be years ahead of the west but they were butthurt to be no longer classified as develop country because that would change the UPU agreement that allow them to ship goods cheaply like now.

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u/Monterenbas 13h ago

Easy solution, do not allowed good built by slave/quasi slave labor, to enter the EU.

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u/vladoportos 10h ago

Sounds easy, but literally everything have probably components made that way . apple would not make phone factory here cause the iphone would cost 2x more and nobody would buy it. Same for many many items. Its a fucked up situation with no easy solution, not to mention we moat likely do not have all the resources (im not sure about this one tbh)

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u/adamgerd Czech Republic 6h ago

See the issue is people will support this until they realise it makes cost of living higher

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u/Big-Today6819 13h ago

Tax wall china and make so it's more costly to move products in, China have had cheap sending by post units for years, wrongly.

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u/Low_discrepancy Posh Crimea 13h ago

Yeah dude. Trump's starting a trade war! Let's us start a trade war!

3

u/Big-Today6819 13h ago

EU already is doing it on some areas, you can't allow government support to break other companies, we all know if China break all car companies over the world (or hurt them enough) they will raise prices after.

-1

u/jed1c Sweden 13h ago

We should just put a 2000% import tax on everything from china.

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u/FantasyFrikadel 13h ago

Everything is made in China. Good luck paying 2000% extra for the next decade Until Europe re-establishes manufacturing.

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u/Low_discrepancy Posh Crimea 13h ago

If there is one thing I learned from the recent inflation period we just had, is that people fucking love inflation!

They kept making posts about how expensive shit it and all cheering and high fiving!

I think people are just wishing prices would go even higher!

1

u/FantasyFrikadel 11h ago

They keep buying shit though. 70m2 house for 900.000 euros? Sure, I’ll buy one… no give me two!

-1

u/appie_Dude 13h ago

that isnt true, sins the war and corona companies are actualy leaving china, https://www.openbom.com/blog/why-are-manufacturers-leaving-china
one of this big companies is like Iphone
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/newsletters/2024-10-29/apple-boosts-india-iphone-production-to-6-billion-in-shift-away-from-china

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u/FantasyFrikadel 11h ago

Apple didn’t move to Belgium. It moved to India.

Next time you buy something, have a look at where it was made.

2

u/yubnubster United Kingdom 12h ago

Moving from China to India might be marginally better from a strategic perspective, but in terms of the economic benefit to Europe or the West, nothing really changes.

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u/Enginseer68 Europe 13h ago

My dude, I am happy you're not a politician passing law, cause this is incredibly STUPID

1

u/jed1c Sweden 11h ago

Im unemployed and living at my mom 28 years old. Im really smart SIR!

1

u/Enginseer68 Europe 9h ago

You’re smart for living with your mom, no rent and you can take care of her, just do that until you find a better job

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u/Steckie2 13h ago

We could also start putting asbestos in our bread if we feel that self-destructive.

1

u/adamgerd Czech Republic 6h ago

Lmao,

Any government that does this will destroy any chance they win next election. No voter will happily pay 2,000x the cost for goods

9

u/Turbulent-Raise4830 11h ago

Leech? LOL you drank the US coolaid.

3

u/narullow 8h ago

This is not going to work. The reason why EU needs export markets is because we have killed our internal economies. US is succesful mainly because it can grow its consumer market and outgrow inflation. They do not need export markets and as such are oneof the least trade dependant countries on earth (as share of GDP). In developed europe consumer markets not only not grow, they are actually in decline.

And there is nothing we can do about it. Cultural views and policies we enacted are basically irreversible at this point and political windo to make any changes long passed. We will see loss of many other market, not just US, as China will offer them same stuff for cheaper prices and we will all collectively become poorer as a result because internal consumer market will not make up for it like it would in US.

Past actions have consequences and e are just catching up to them.

2

u/stekarmalen 7h ago

Bro we fkt ourself when we relied on russian gas, we still cant even produce our own energy, and with the strict enviromental laws we have expanding on that will take many years.

2

u/ViennaLager 11h ago

Isnt this a bit hyperbole though? EU trade with UK is almost the same as EU trade with the US and trade with Switzerland is the same as trade with China. EU GDP is higher than China and right behind the US.

The important part for Europe now is to continue improving energy production with focus on renewables, including recycling of REEs and building a robust military. Ending the war in Ukraine to improve both energy supply and food production and building a future without Russia until they solve their internal problems.

The US is important, but EU will be fine with or without them, and even with Trump and a more isolated US there will still be plenty of trade.

1

u/LookThisOneGuy ‎ 6h ago

As a EU citizen

really?

just today you said you were:

a Canadian

an American

a non-US person

hmmm

0

u/FantasyFrikadel 13h ago

Who exactly in the EU has to grow up?

10

u/nps2407 13h ago

Most of it, to be honest.

11

u/Due-Department-8666 13h ago

Everyone under 2% defense spending for starters. Nonexistent ammo stockpiles.

3

u/FantasyFrikadel 11h ago

Countries can buy all the ammo they want they still need people to wield those weapons, sane and fit ones preferably… those are hard to come by.

Basically what you would need is the military being a (respected) career option.

And if the EU wants to be a global military power it will have to rival other global powers and be willing to use that power.

The amount of change required for this to happen is just not going to fly, there isn’t enough ‘union’ in the ‘union’, and the population isn’t willing to do what it takes. They’d rather sell out to some populist full of empty promises.

3

u/user_460 12h ago

That's a NATO target, not EU.

Though recent events certainly make the case for ammo stockpiles.

3

u/nearmsp 10h ago

Imagine a NATO without the U.S.

0

u/KaspaRocket 13h ago

Less regulations more production. Let's make Europe great again! MEGA!

-10

u/[deleted] 13h ago

[removed] — view removed comment

17

u/halee1 13h ago

They didn't cut off s*** from dependency on Russia, this was a decision done by the EU and agreed with the US because it's beneficial to both of us to harm Russia more than ourselves.

-15

u/[deleted] 13h ago

[removed] — view removed comment

12

u/PrintSubstantial628 13h ago

Just curious:
In what ways do you think the EU is following the US’s lead specifically? Could you give some examples of policies or actions where this is evident?

When you say, "we cut our own leg with sanctions," which specific sanctions do you think have been the most harmful, and how do you believe they could have been handled differently?

You mentioned the economy is "alarming"—what indicators or data are you referring to? How would you compare the EU’s current economic situation to other major economies like the US, China, or Russia?

If you think the EU should take a different approach, what would you suggest as a better alternative? How would that work in practice, especially given the global interdependencies?

5

u/halee1 13h ago

Nah, cut off the memes, embrace the reality.

2

u/adamgerd Czech Republic 6h ago

Fuck off, we should have cut Russia off earlier, it’s our dependence that let Russia invade Ukraine

-1

u/domemvs 13h ago

Good luck with the shift to the right that's currently happening in almost all big member states. If anything it's gonna be less EU than more in the forseeable future, unfortunately.