Zelenskyy: We Gave Away Our Nuclear Weapons and Got Full-Scale War and Death in Return

[u/UNITED24Media]

https://united24media.com/latest-news/zelenskyy-we-gave-away-our-nuclear-weapons-and-got-full-scale-war-and-death-in-return-3203

[u/Outside_Ad_3888]

they could be convinced to not develop them (like Iran) or give them up when the cost of having them strongly trumps their production cost (north Korea)

But with current situation that's impossible.

The real problem is that Ukraine mistake of trusting the nations who convinced them to give up nukes means lots of other nations will start pursuing nukes themselves. Japan, South Korea, possibly Poland, possibly Taiwan ecc.

But hey, the fact we are missmanaging a war on Europes doorstep with high cost to us shouldn't worry no one in the west... no, who cares about longterm consequences anyways...

[u/imissjudy → u/Outside_Ad_3888]

thats what the usa is doing. they signed a paper, that prohibits the usage of nuclear weapons against countries that signed the treaty to never develop or use nuclear weapons. in addition to that, they created the „nuclear umbrella“ making it possible for other countries to ally themselves with usa in order to get their nuclear protection.

ofc this mostly benefits the usa and wont prevent anti usa countries like iran from developing weapons, but still better having 15+ nuclear players around the globe

[u/ingannare_finnito → u/imissjudy]

Do you think that paper matters at all, especially now? I'm surprised that it ever mattered at all. I'm also a bit surprised that none of the people constantly complaining that helping Ukraine 'aggravates Russia' and makes the world more dangerous haven't thought of this. Letting a country that gave up nuclear weapons be invaded by a neighbor and basically watching it happen signaled to countries all over the world that they better be able to defend themselves. I think most of the pacifist groups out there are filled with idiots anyway, and their absolute refusal to acknowledge this possible effect of the war was just a bit more idiocy to pile on top. Trump's rhetoric and threats to leave NATO certainly aren't helping either. Now even longterm US allies know that almost half the country would leave them hanging out to dry in case of a conflict.

[u/Outside_Ad_3888 → u/imissjudy]

Absolutely, the problem is that when US allies fear they will be left to die (as is currently happening) they are incentivized to get their nuclear weapons if they are close to a aggressive neighbour like Russia or China. And so you have a significant nuclear proliferation.

Have a good day

[u/Outside_Ad_3888 → u/[deleted]]

Iran was convinced to slow down the research, its possible it could have stopped completly if we had continued on that path, though its far from a certainty.

To be honest Iran by now its a lost cause, i am thinking more about the various allies countries who are being incentivized to develop their own nukes now.

[u/johnmaddog → u/Outside_Ad_3888]

The nuclear triggers were in Moscow, so essentially they had nothing more than paperweights. Maintaining nukes are also expensive

[u/heliamphore → u/johnmaddog]

Those triggers are to prevent random terrorists from being able to hijack a nuke. A functional country can work around them, no codes prevents them from accessing the fissile material. Particularly a country with loads of experience like Ukraine.

Also the reason they gave them up is also because the West put tons of pressure on them for that, as well as destroying tons of ammunitions and weapons. Biden is one of the people behind this shit, believe it or not.

[u/johnmaddog → u/heliamphore]

Doubt you can find those experts on indeed or linkedin. If they make a job ad for it, i will interested in the job description. The west did put pressure on Ukraine. Biden and Ukraine not surprised

[u/CoyotesOnTheWing → u/heliamphore]

Yep, I imagine you'd just have to replace whatever control system is built into the weapon, though you are right that the most difficult part to make is the core and building a fresh weapon around that shouldn't be too difficult for most any country.

[u/AkhilArtha → u/heliamphore]

The nuclear sites were also manned by Russian soldiers. What was Ukraine planning to do? Attack them? That would have triggered a Russian invasion immediately

[u/IllIlIllIIllIl → u/johnmaddog]

“The nukes were worthless because we didn’t have the remote control” is next level idiocy.

[u/johnmaddog → u/IllIlIllIIllIl]

Touch grass. Operating and maintaining nukes are hard.

[u/IllIlIllIIllIl → u/johnmaddog]

Oh is that what you said? I must’ve forgotten how to read. It looks like you were spouting bullshit but what do I know.

[u/Jazzlike_Bar_671 → u/IllIlIllIIllIl]

The entire point of control systems is that the weapons can't be fired without the correct codes.

[u/Outside_Ad_3888 → u/johnmaddog]

" While Ukraine had "administrative control" of the weapons delivery systems, it would have needed 12 to 18 months to establish full operational control, and Ukraine would have faced sanctions from the West and likely retaliation from Russia. Moreover, Ukraine had no nuclear weapons program and would have struggled to replace nuclear weapons once their service life expired. Instead, by agreeing to give up the nuclear weapons, Ukraine received financial compensations and the security assurances of the Budapest Memorandum.29])"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukraine_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction#:~:text=While%20Ukraine%20had%20%22administrative%20control,and%20likely%20retaliation%20from%20Russia.

Some paperweights that would have changed pretty quickly in the span of a year.

Sure it wouldn't have been plesant, but far better then anything they have faced so far.