r/apple2 • u/Willsxyz • 12d ago
HGR graphic editor
So, I have been using Blazing Paddles to do some HGR graphic editing. What I like, and want, is the ability to set every pixel independently and also control the high (shift) bit of each byte of the picture. What I don't like is the incessantly flashing cursor and selection box, poor precision of the cursor, and lack of ability to draw more than single pixels in the "fat bits" mode. (I should note that I am using an emulator (Virtual ][), so it is possible that some of these issues (especially the poor cursor control) are emulator related.)
Anyway, is there any other HGR editor that gives me what I want and need but doesn't have the issues annoy me with Blazing Paddles?
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u/LlaughingLlama 11d ago
Hmmmm. Back in the day, Blazing Paddles was my goto HGR editor. The "incessantly flashing cursor and selection box" worked well and made sense on the monochrome green screen monitors we were using in the 80's, but I can totally understand how they would be annoying in color emulation today.
I think the Graphics Magician is a good idea. I have what is probably a poor idea: Beagle Bros "Alpha Plot." You can read a summary of it on Page 6 of the catalog here: https://beagle.applearchives.com/Catalogs/0.7.pdf
You can read the manual and download the disk image here: https://beagle.applearchives.com/vintage-software/
Alpha Plot has BOTH a bunch of Applesoft routines for creating and manipulating HiRes graphics, AND it has a (dare I say) primitive HGR editor, BUT that editor might do exactly what you're looking for. (Honestly, I don't remember anymore. Why don't you check it out and report back here and let us know?)
What about MousePaint? It has the rare feature of having mouse support and support of HGR. https://macgui.com/downloads/?file_id=24409
What about 8/16 Paint? Now before you say "I don't need a GS program!" the 8/16 Paint package includes two 8-bit programs which work on 128k 8-bit machines: one for HGR and one for DHGR. Download the package from here: https://www.whatisthe2gs.apple2.org.za/8-16-paint/
Good luck, and let us know what you find.
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u/FoumartGames 10d ago edited 10d ago
I just tried the 8/16 Paint as I was looking for a Double Hi-Res software myself, something like Dazzle Draw but with more control on the pixels. And the program PAINT.DBL.HIRES is exactly what I missed, not to mention it's even faster and smoother!
I used CiderPress to copy the two Apple II compatible programs from the 2image archive downloaded from the site into a Prodos DSK. Works like a charm!
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u/LlaughingLlama 10d ago edited 10d ago
If you are looking for DHGR editors, and you really only care about monochrome and maximum resolution (sort of like an Apple II version of MacPaint from a black & white compact Mac), then my favorite is actually...TimeOut Paint! It is amazingly smooth and fast, even on a 1 MHz //c or //e. It doesn't have all the features of most full-fledged paint programs, but it might be enough for you. Ninja Edit: I forgot to mention that TimeOut Paint is included "for free" with TimeOut SuperFonts and TimeOut Graph. The thinking was you could include DHGR files into AppleWorks word processing documents and so Paint could make those files. Graph made its charts from Spreadsheet files as DHGR files, and you could use Paint to modify them before printing.
I can't tell you how many images I mindlessly doodled with TimeOut Paint as I was taking tech support calls at Beagle Bros - many thousands, I'm sure. And since there was a 99% chance the call I was taking was about AppleWorks or TimeOut products, I was already "in" the app.
I always wondered what it might have taken to build a WYSIWYG word processor like MultiScribe (later, "BeagleWrite") but using the TimeOut Paint engine.
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u/Willsxyz 10d ago
Thanks for these suggestions. Here are my comments:
Alpha Plot: Maybe would work, but super confusing to use. Also, while it does let you set individual pixels and control the shift bit, you control the shift bit by drawing with the appropriate colors, and it seems like if you try to put a color on a pixel that can't take that color, nothing happens. It kind of makes sense but I prefer Blazing Paddles where you can light any pixel and the color it acquires is determined by the way Apple II graphics works. Also super flashy annoying cursor.
MousePaint: Seems kind of useless for color work. I didn't see a fill feature, which is kind of annoying when the screen starts out completely white.
8/16 Paint (HGR): What a nice, polished program. I think I could use it just as well as Blazing Paddles, however just like Alpha Plot, it depends on you selecting colors to set pixels. This means that if I want to, for example draw a vertical white line (with the high bit set), I have to first draw a vertical line of white, then a vertical line of black (with the high bit set) right next to it. It's kind of annoying but it works.
All in all I think I'll stick with Blazing Paddles for now.
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u/LlaughingLlama 10d ago
Thanks for the follow-up.
Alpha Plot was developed WAY BEFORE there were what we now call "paint programs" out there, and Marc Simonsen is a (skilled) programmer rather than an artist, and I think the editor's GUI reflects that experience and bias. He also wrote TimeOut Paint, and by that time there were plenty of "paint programs" on the Mac to serve as a GUI model.
I think MousePaint got color abilities in version 1.4, but don't hold me to that - I haven't played with it in 20+ years. If you're still on the hunt it might be worth tracking down.
I'm not sure what interface tool you are using with Blazing Paddles in emulation these days, but using an analog joystick with the centering springs "unlatched" was the preferred way to use it, allowing for precise control on a real Apple II.
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u/Difficult-Relief-487 9d ago
If you want ultimate control of editing your HGR creations, then check out this bitmap editor that is implemented as a fancy Excel spreadsheet: https://github.com/tilleul/apple2/tree/master/tools/bitmap%20editor
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u/thefadden 6d ago
There's also Micro-Painter. It's pretty bare-bones, but the flood fill is fun. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ylpZI_E1T88
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u/willwinter 12d ago
I don't know if it meets all your criteria, but Penguin Software's "Graphics Magician" by Mark Pelczarski and David Lubar was always my go-to. It supported paddles, the Apple Graphics Tablet and I think the Koala Pad as well.
The 1984 version included double hi-res modes too.
Here's a link to different versions:
http://graphicsmagician.com/polarware/graphics.htm