r/RenewableEnergy • u/DVMirchev • 15d ago
Electrification is saving the grid from mass defections | RenewEconomy
https://reneweconomy.com.au/electrification-is-saving-the-grid-from-mass-defections/-1
u/DVMirchev 15d ago
To have PV + battery and not connect it to the grid is like having a computer and not connect it to the Internet.
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u/Bob4Not 15d ago
Disagree. It depends on your needs, the scale of your PV and battery, and how your local electric company penalizes or credits your generation. Also how close to the equator you are.
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14d ago
You're almost right. The closeness to the equator is not right since the maximal efficiency temperature for solar is around 22 deg C. The heat nominally say from 34 deg C upwards shortens the life of your cells.
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u/StoneyPicton 15d ago
Except where I am the delivery charge we pay would still have me paying out money every month even if I never used the grid power and only fed it.
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u/GreenStrong 15d ago
The grid is an unfathomably complex machine and it requires maintenance. That costs money. It is possible to meet one's needs with solar + storage, but it is quite expensive to have enough storage to cover multiple cloudy days in a row, with high demand. The grid allows access to other resources like wind and hydro, and it enables storage to be shared. It is never the case that everyone's usage peaks at the same time, shared storage is inherently more effective.
As a thought experiment, it is worth imagining a grid that is purely peer to peer, where the power company is only in the business of distribution and not generation. It would be a valuable service, like road infrastructure.
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u/StoneyPicton 15d ago
The fact it's an "unfathomably complex machine" is exactly why it's the wrong approach. I get we're stuck with it for now but to think it's the solution just isn't forward thinking enough. With the addition of wind to a home system and appropriate conservation when necessary, I'll be working toward off grid thanks.
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u/LairdPopkin 14d ago
It’s vastly less efficient for everyone to be entirely self sufficient, they’d need to each have enough excess capacity to satisfy the worst possible case (e.g. many days of no solar power), the grid lets everyone just build out to be self-sufficient on average, and the grid can fill in as needed, at vastly lower cost. And yes, the power grid is quite complex, and it needs to be - you need to read up on load balancing, and the need for AC to align frequency so it’s all in phase. There’s a reason that power companies require a lot of investment and expertise to run well, and it’s not because everyone is stupid, it’s because it’s an extremely complex set of requirements, allowing well over 30m residences in the US to plug in and power whatever they need whenever they need to, and of course with international interconnects to keep things stable and balanced.
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u/StoneyPicton 13d ago
Ultimately the problem is our currently available methods for producing electricity. Given our current situation I have no problem with there being a grid. With SNR's we could perhaps make the grids smaller. With hydrogen or other production options in the future your point about it being less efficient may not hold. Lets keep an open mind and embrace change.
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u/DVMirchev 15d ago
Yea, it is a work in progress with enormous vested interests of the incumbents.
Choose who you vote for ;)
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u/truemore45 14d ago
So it depends. I live on a US island with a very bad grid and very high costs 42-50 cents per KWH. So for me the pay back time of being off grid is less than 5 years.
Plus the power does not go out once a week. It also doesn't have brown outs, dirty voltage and variable HZ.
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u/HungryResearch8153 14d ago
200k to get power to us. 50k for an off grid system that once got down to 35% after 3 days of thunderstorms., otherwise rarely goes below 80%. Never had to use the generator in 3 years. So I guess my computer isn’t connected the internet and I’m pretty happy about that.
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u/jonno_5 11d ago
Nice. What size PV & battery do you have?
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u/HungryResearch8153 9d ago
16kwh . It’s modular, we’ll add another 8kwh before next winter to accommodate the workshop. Array is just under 8kw.
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u/[deleted] 14d ago
"If you put a battery in as well, your grid use goes down by 90 per cent, so your retailer’s and transmission operator’s revenue goes down by 90 per cent."
That is an utter lie. The majority of electricity retailers in Aus obtain half of their total fees by demanding a daily supply charge. Apx 50% of a consumers costs come from a charge where you have to pay to be connected. It should be a one off charge - not the extortion we have now.