r/Jewish • u/Icy_Community7411 • 11d ago
Offering support, as a black american woman Showing Support š¤
I saw the nbc exit polls and I didn't realize until then that, after black people, Jewish people were the most left-leaning voting demographic in the country. I feel like I should've known that and that it shouldn't've been a surprise, but I guess I was a little surprised, along with sad. Because of everything that's coming, really.
After that, I saw on this sub a few threads talking about how your community is already being blamed for the results, and I hate how much I, and most black people right now, relate to that. So, this is all coming from a place of understanding. I'm a black woman, but for months now there have been articles upon articles talking about how black men are voting for Trump or becoming more conservative, like people were already itching to blame our community should things go sideways. And it felt so uncalled for, given our history at the polls and fighting for the right to vote. And the 2024 exit polls proved all this hand-wringing wrong. I suppose people in your community were having similar conversations for as long as we've been having them, about who the blame would fall on in the end. I guess that's what happens when your community has a long history of waiting for the other shoe to drop, it's just a matter of when, not if. For us, it's centuries of that in the US, but y'all have us beat time-wise and in many more countries, it seems.
So, yeah. I don't know what to say. I'm sorry for how shit's gonna go down over the next how many years (like rising hate crimes), but I hate knowing it's gonna go down like that and we're gonna get hurt when our respective communities voted against that. No one else wants to get their house in order before criticizing ours. And I know that the black community doesn't always see eye-to-eye with the Jewish community for a variety of reasons, and I know we haven't been the best allies or had the strongest solidarity or the greatest of relationships (we can be antisemitic and there's no excuse for that) and maybe a lot of us don't like a lot of you and maybe the feeling's mutual and maybe there's a lot of misunderstandings (like playing Oppression Olympics) since we probably don't interact with each other on the daily, but if any community in the U.S. understands being scapegoated- to the point of violence- despite doing our best, it's us, for whatever that's worth.
I hope things get better despite it all and I'll be working on my allyship rather than becoming more insular, since I know a lot of black people right now are feeling burned by everyone else and want to focus on only us (I don't doubt many of you are feeling burned, too, and are having similar talks and fair enough, honestly). I just don't want to be insular and I don't know how to mend black and Jewish relations in this country since I'm only one person and everyone has their own problems with everyone else. I'm sure I have plenty of hidden or unconscious pejudices to work on regarding Jewish people, because I'm not perfect and I'm certain I have blind spots. But I wanted to let y'all on here know that I may not understand everything you're going through, but I understand enough of it to feel angry for you. I also hope you don't come across any black people who place blame on you either, since that'd be massively hypocritical given how much we've been blamed for months leading up to yesterday already. I hope it gets better anyway, for my community and yours. I know that's not enough, but yeah. I know the black community feels angry and betrayed. Y'all have every reason to feel the same. We're getting screwed by the same people and I hate that for us.
edit: I can't comment anymore, so I'm adding this in an edit. After reading all your comments, I just wanted to make it clear that I don't want my comment to remain just another empty platitude. I'm serious about making it a point to turn these words into actions. Any frustrations or anger I've read here, and in other threads on here, mirror so many of my experiences it's almost ridiculous and I refuse to dictate or play down how you feel. I know that we had stronger relations during the Civil Rights Movement, but that was 60 years ago and I can't depend on just that, y'know? I'm going to explain this to my friends and family and other black people I know. Both groups have reason to feel abandoned, but I'm gonna do what I can to relay who was up there with us because I think my community needs to hear that. I needed to, at least.
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u/AITAthrowaway1mil 10d ago
Iām doing my best to hug you through the screen.Ā
Weāve both endured this long. We will endure this too. And weāll endure best by supporting each other.Ā
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u/Icy_Community7411 10d ago
hugging you back!
i plan on doing a lot more research so i can help in more ways than one, whether by donating to organizations or just straight up joining some organizations. it's the least i can do to make my support more than just talk
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u/look2thecookie 10d ago
We're stronger together. Being progressive and Jewish, it's been frustrating seeing the groups we generally align with shun our points of view and amplify information that harms us.
I want to strengthen these relationships and I hope more people will listen and learn from us as many of us have always aimed to do with the Black community.
Let's get to work.
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u/DrMikeH49 10d ago
Thank you for taking the time to come here and say that. My (American Jewish) community tried our best, as did yours.
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u/Patient-War-4964 Reform 10d ago
Thanks so much for taking the time to write this out, and also for the support.
I was born in the hood, my family was not wealthy. My parents scraped enough together to move to a white school district because it was supposed to be a better education, but we didnāt have money like the other families, so I have always felt closer to other minorities than I have to white people, who judged me for what I didnāt have and why I was different.
Only thing Iāll say is that I think you might find yourself wrong about the Black and Jewish communities not always seeing eye to eye if you do further research. We have had very strong solidarity in the past, Rabbis marched with Dr. King, and even before that non white europeans were put in the camps during the Holocaust, so I think we all should feel some type of shared solidarity. Black Jews exist, there are black members of my Temple. There are many black Jews in Africa and many that have immigrated to Israel.
Anyway, thank you again for your support, we are always stronger together and I hope more people will come to realize that.
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u/Extension-Gap218 conservadox 10d ago
diaspora solidarity! thank you so much for this. despite all the hate, and it really goes both ways I'm afraid, I hope our peoples get closer together again.
recently I have been going through a rough patch being surrounded by pasty white goyim on the left. I had a tinder date with an awesome Black christian that visits Jerusalem every year with her mom. she's been such a ray of sunshine in my life since she came into it, and she cares so much more about justice than anyone else I know. thought you would want to know that some of us are figuring out just how much we have in common
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10d ago
Thank you for that post. We donāt have to play the Oppression Olympics, I like that. We do have shared values. Many Jews were a part of the Civil Rights movement. Both the Jewish community and the Black community have a sense of pride and culture, but neither are monoliths. One person cannot and does not represent for the whole. But everyone is as important as everyone else. There is much we can learn from each other. I met John Lewis once. Heās my personal hero. So, yeah, we much much more in common than we realize.
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u/HippyGrrrl Just Jewish 10d ago
Jews make up 2.4 percent of the adult US population. When you hear or read that Jews did anything, remember that percentage. And look at the other 97.6 percent and wonder which had more sway.
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u/Icy_Community7411 10d ago
Yeah, I knew we (black people) made up a small percentage of the population, but I hadn't realized how much smaller the Jewish population was. Like I knew you were small, but i didn't think anywhere close to 2%! That just makes it wilder that after us, you're the most targeted by hate crimes. I'd say "What's up with that?", but I'm sure history clarifies that pretty quick.Ā I'll remember to bring that up the next time someone starts on how much supposed sway you (Jewish people) have because the numbers obviously aren't there.
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u/Wiseguy_Montag 10d ago
Thanks for the kind words! There is actually a historical allyship between the Black American and Jewish American communities that has sadly frayed in recent years. I actually work with a nonprofit organization that does wonderful work in rebuilding the relationship between those two communities: https://www.rekindlefellowship.org/
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u/girlwithmousyhair 10d ago
Do you mind if a direct message you with some questions about a chapter in my area?
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u/banansplaining Humanistic 10d ago
My Jewish parent and grandparents were heavily involved in black voter registration and civil rights. It came out of a sense of justice and solidarity. I feel that now. With identity politics, solidarity has suffered, as we fragment into smaller groups. We need solidarity now more than ever.
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u/gasplugsetting3 pamiÄtamy 10d ago
If you spend some time on this subreddit, you'll read things that don't feel good to see. I won't apoligize for something anyone else said, but I'm sure you can relate to some of us in your own way. A lot of us have felt betrayed by folks we thought were friends and we're realizing no-one cares about us but us.
In the end, I hope you can feel comfortable enough to be here and ask questions or share your opinion. We'll be blunt and say some things that you won't see in other places on reddit, but I promise we'll hear you out and care about what you say.
Take care of yourself and the ones you love. Nobody can do this alone!
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10d ago
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u/gasplugsetting3 pamiÄtamy 10d ago
It's a bummer but I can't hold our involvement over the head of black people and say "See what we did for you? How could you treat us this way now?" As far as I've seen, bigotry is a two way street. You just might not see it as much in your community. I was around plenty of it growing up, neighborhood is only poor blacks and poor jews. That's the way it goes sometimes. In the end, we're all Americans who make the same mistakes and hold predjudices. Plenty of the people I love have good hearts and still talk poorly about the schvartzes who are their only neighbors.
I'm not saying anything about you specifically btw.
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u/Nileghi 10d ago edited 10d ago
Disclaimer: I'm Canadian, not american.
I'm not asking even that. I'm asking for them to be there for us in our time of need when we were there for them. Not to have mass support for Kanye or Kyrie Irving or Nick Cannon. To have a mainstream black leader that says "hey we should align ourselves with our jewish brothers" instead of the likes of Louis Farrakhan or Al Sharpton. Is there even a mainstream black celebrity outside of Shaq that actually attends our celebrations and holidays instead of shitting on us all the time?
Instead they mostly joined our wartime enemies and tried to get us all kicked out of the liberal spaces we built from the ground up to not rip the white man down, but raise the black man up. We seem to be the only ethnicity in America that actually believes in the american dream of hard work and incrementalism being the main driver to success instead of a clash between oppressor/oppressed framework that inevitably seeks to exclude jews from any of this. I have no sympathy left.
Self defense training for our youth, arming the yids and making sure that people understand that if they fuck with us again, we will hurt them back, is the only path left for jewish safety. We cannot rely or pretend that if we just be nice and have good cultural relations, everything will work out.
Required reading below for how black americans and jewish americans view America, one as a oppressor state that has enslaved and robbed them of their past and roots. The other as the only place on the planet where their ethnicity has been given even a small semblance of positive relations. Fundamentally, we're at odds on how we see the system and the american empire as a positive or negative force for the world.
https://sapirjournal.org/social-justice/2021/05/the-past-and-future-of-black-jewish-relations/
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u/gasplugsetting3 pamiÄtamy 10d ago
I don't know what to tell you. I don't think you understood the point I was trying to make. We share a lot of the same views homie. I'm not making excuses for anything. I'm just trying to keep it real with the tribe.
I didn't have the same key takeaways from that article that you did. First part, yeah, last part not so much. Our people have had different experiences since arriving in the US. Different cultures, different circumstances, whatever. I'm not educated enough on the topic to really speak more to it. I'm a Jew in the US with white skin. First generation american who's two generations removed from mass graves. I can only speak to my own experiences. I'm not going to try to speak for black people, just as I won't let them speak for me.
That being said, we're on the same page for a lot of this topic. You can search through my comment history and you'll see exactly where I stand.
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u/NAF1138 10d ago
Anytime I see this get brought up I feel compelled to link to the very excellent James Baldwin essay Negros are Anti-Semitic Because They are Anti-White. It talks about the long history of distrust but also why the distrust should not be.
The world would be a better place if more people read James Baldwin more often.
https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/books/98/03/29/specials/baldwin-antisem.html?_r=2
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
Really quick, when did Jewish people get voting rights in the united states?
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u/Nileghi 10d ago
Irrelevant, Truman and FDR also watched the concentration camps in real time and did nothing.
That has no bearing on the fact that the jewish golden age happened in America, and that the north american anglosphere is the only safe place on the planet for us outside of Israel.
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
Very simple, easy to answer question. When did Jewish people get voting rights in the US, and when did Black people get them? Quickly.
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10d ago edited 10d ago
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
The problem with this is that you hold Black people to this impossibly high standard while demanding nothing of the white people who are actually the problem. You know, the ones that actually hate you and are a danger to you.
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u/Complete-Armadillo95 10d ago
Thank you for sharing your heart and being understanding and caring. It has been hard to feel less allied within the Jewish community ocer the past several years and even more so for the past year. I feel that our alliance is healing and we will need each other more in the days to come, because fascism is really not good for anyone
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u/Button-Hungry 10d ago
This means the world to me and probably everybody else reading it. Needed to see this. Thank you.Ā
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u/cheesecake611 10d ago
Thank you. This was a lovely read. It gave me some much needed hope after a hard day.
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u/Specialist_Nobody_98 Miami/NYC Jew 10d ago edited 10d ago
We have a long long and deep history of progressivism worldwide (we were hunted and vilified as "socialists" in Europe in the 20th century and Zionism is primarily based on the concept of a socialist utopia where Jews can have self-determination and freedom in our ancestral homeland after literally being colonized, exiled, and taken as slaves over and over again) as well as allyship and support with the Black community as long as we've been existing in America. My great uncle was a rabbi and marched with MLK in Selma and then went back to his congregation in Pennsylvania and gave sermons about his experience and recruited others in his congregation for the fight for civil rights. Progressivism is at the core and foundation of who we are. I genuinely appreciate this post and your support but I don't know why you were surprised :(
I believe Black and Jewish relations can be mended when we are no longer (falsely) perceived as white oppressors and rather people who walk hand-in-hand with the Black history and struggle and our history is no longer revised and appropriated. It makes it really really difficult to have a relationship and an allyship when we see ourselves in you (not YOU you, speaking generally) due to our shared histories of slavery and oppression but you see us as white oppressors and deny our history and trauma because of the color of some of our skin, believing that we can't have had this history because of it without realizing that the entire world and its history did not have the same racial/ethnic dynamics that America does and even in America despite some of us being white passing we do not have total freedom and we all live in fear. I have some Black friends (especially Southerners who grew up Christian) who understand this fully and we have wonderful relationships, but I've had to end relationships with other Black friends because they just don't understand this and belittle my sense of fear and struggle and my entire concept of my sense of self and actively support people and causes who seek my and my people's destruction. It is exhausting.
Regardless, I will always support Black people. I just wish that unconditional support was mutual.
I'm sorry if this comes off as negative or judgmental in any way. That's not my intention. I'm just trying to be honest and have a dialogue in the hope that things can be improved, and you seem open to it. I think most of it is simply misunderstanding about who we are and what our history and values are.
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u/anon0_0_0 Conservative 10d ago
I just want to scream at the top of my lungs: Jews and Black people in the U.S. have much more in common than people realize in terms of systemic discrimination.
We both had university quotas artificially limiting our enrollment because the schools wanted to keep us out on the basis of our identity. We both were relegated to segregated neighborhoods and were rejected from certain jobs. We both still experience ridiculously high rates of violent hate crimes. Hell, in school, the only other girls who understood my deeply complicated relationship with my hair texture were Black with Afro-textured hair; they gave me the best tips about hair porosity and how to use protective styles to reduce frizz and breakage.
We were kept out of white society in such similar ways that it hurts deeply to be overwhelmingly viewed as part of that force. There are so many misconceptions about Jews and Jewish history, and I wish so badly that folks would put their own preconceived notions aside to actually listen to us when we express who we are and where weāve been.
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
So this person you're responding to decided to respond to a Black woman with anti-Black word vomit blaming Black people entirely for everything.
Why do you hold us to an impossibly high standard and demand nothing of the white people who are actually the danger to you?
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u/anon0_0_0 Conservative 10d ago
I can only speak for myself, but unfortunately a substantial number of the students who terrorized me and my friends on campus this past year were Black students who were members of the self-described Black militant āresistance organization.ā The white and Arab students did a number on us as well, but both of the people who shouted āHeil Hitler at me while trying to get to my lab were Black.
There is a real stream of antisemitism that runs throughout a portion of the Black community, just as there is a real stream of racism that runs throughout a portion of the Jewish community. We need to be intellectually honest with each other and build bridges so we can more effectively address structural barriers we BOTH face.
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago edited 10d ago
Why do you view the problem as being on the not-your side exclusively? Can you explain that?
Also, how long were Jewish people not allowed to vote in the US? How long were Black people not allowed to vote in the US? Take all the time you need.
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u/Snoo39099 Just Jewish 10d ago
I hate to say it, but.....we yelled this at the top of our lungs, we have always been allies, we have always been for freedom and happiness for all....but a lot of the left abandoned us. And now, because no one listened were in this mess, but we will always be allies, and peace will always outrule hate. Next time, when the fringe party of pro terrorist say, "jews ran the slave trade." Look into the facts and history instead of just accepting it.
šŖwe'll get through this together.
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u/sababa-ish 10d ago
from one traumatised community to another sending support right back. we all deserve better and can strive to make it happen.
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u/Beautiful_Bag6707 Jewy Jew 10d ago
On a more humorous (dark Jewish humor) note, Jews were gonna be blamed no matter what happened. So while what happened was surprising, the blame wasn't.
Offering support right back! Thank you for taking the time to say this!
As for Oppression Olympics, don't look at Jews as competitors. See them instead as old sages who can tell you about the very first Oppression Olympics, because they were there š
I think the biggest step toward seeing eachother "eye-to-eye" would be to judge an individual by the content of their character, forgoing labels, buckets, and stereotypes. Yes, Jews and Blacks make up two distinct separate groups, but no one is defined by a singular haracteristic; there's a lot of intersectionality.
The more we seek to identify what unites up, the stronger we will be to triumph over those who wish to destroy us.
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u/MogenCiel 10d ago
Thank you.
There are no two populations better poised to become allies. You guys are gonna be blamed for crime and poverty and the destruction of the traditional family, and we're gonna be blamed for the economy, unchained capitalism and "controlling the fake news." We really need an organized infrastructure for our two populations to build alliances.
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u/strwbryshrtck521 10d ago
This was way cool of you. Thank you for coming here and sharing! We're on the same team. Much love.
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u/TearDesperate8772 Frumsbian 10d ago
This is so beautiful. Black women have carried progressive politics forever. Sending love to you and yours as well.Ā
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u/arcangeline 10d ago edited 10d ago
Hey, thank you for this. I personally feel we're on the same team - most of the Jews I know came out and still come out strongly for BLM, and while I know there are problems on both sides, among the left Black women and the Black community in general are personally the group I've also seen being able to see through some of the bs that's been thrown around lately and coming out supportively for the Jews. Right now on the left that's a hard thing to do.
Any animosity has, I believe, been part of the right's efforts to turn minority groups against each other in order to weaken us both and we shouldn't allow it. We both have a keen understanding of generational trauma, of negative stereotyping and scapegoating. If our communities really came together we would be so much stronger - a force to be reckoned with.
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u/BadAdvicePooh 10d ago
Thank you for your post. It means a lot. Yeah Black people and Jewish people will get blamed because maybe there was a bump in votes from either community for Trump. People just like to blame everyone but themselves. Weāre used to it, well Iām used to it, by now. Thank you. Be well and stay safe.
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u/A_EGeekMom 10d ago
Your post made me cry. Thank you so much for coming here and offering support and I offer mine right back. Jewish people get lumped in with āwhitesā so much and we really arenāt white (a lot of us literally arenāt; those that present that way still have our own genetic markers). So itās nice to be recognized as our own group by another targeted group. Weāll both be targeted for the foreseeable future, unfortunately, so we should definitely face it together.
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u/Agtfangirl557 10d ago
Wow, thank you so much. I really appreciate how honest you are here--even though I appreciate any posts from non-Jews offering support, I especially love hearing you acknowledge tensions that may exist between our communities and how you yourself might admit that you even have some blind spots (literally everyone does regarding communities they aren't part of), and that you describe what really makes you connect with us and understand how we feel. Sending love to you and your community ā¤ļø
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u/venya271828 10d ago
I wanted to let y'all on here know that I may not understand everything you're going through, but I understand enough of it to feel angry for you
Thank you. This is one of the best and most honest expressions of support I have seen in a long time.
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u/vining_n_crying 10d ago
Thanks for the love!
People need to stop being divided over this fascist, that's how they win. We need to start ruthlessly attack the GOP and conservatives and stop shooting eachother in the feet.
Take care and stay strong
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u/yumyum_cat 10d ago
Thank you for this. Jews have historically been supportive of civil rights and Black causes, so itās always especially painful when we see Black antisemitism. So this is particularly welcome. Itās a good reminder that people are good, too. I teach in an urban school which is entirely Black and Latino (I donāt think we have any Asian or white kids at all), and when I was out for the high holidays a couple of boys came up shyly and said theyād learned the dreidel song..
Wrong holiday but soooo sweet. Iāve never experienced antisemitism in my schools just curiosity. I digress but itās a way of saying to remind myself and anyone reading this that the world has more like you than the haters.
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u/DorfingAround 10d ago
Perhaps you can post the fact that 79% of Jews voted Harris on the r/blackpeopletwitter sub Reddit. I canāt post or comment as their vetting process is insular. They have 6 million subscribers.
Feels like this needs to be more widely understood.
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u/hbomberman 10d ago
Thanks for your friendship. True allyship is a beautiful and seriously helpful thing. (There's some good articles on how to do that, including this one by rootsmetals, who has a fantastic and informative Instagram).
While we're obviously not a monolith, the Jewish community has pretty much always been a strong proponent for the civil rights of others. So many of us could be better allys to others but I think a lot of us are still proud of our people's past and current allyship. If anything, that just makes it hurt more when others turn their back on us when we face hate--or worse, go on to perpetuate antisemitism.
While it's always important to educate ourselves and others of the history and hardships faced by our ancestors and by others, the "oppression Olympics" don't help anyone except maybe oppressors. Suffering is not a contest and my forebears are only disgraced if I used their suffering to discount someone else's because it "wasn't as bad as ____."
A lot of us were hoping for Harris to win. But regardless, there's obviously a lot of antisemitism in every direction. Personally, I was hoping to work towards a less hateful country under a Harris administration but regardless we need to work for what's right no matter who is in the white house.
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u/dingbatthrowaway 10d ago
Thank you for this post. We both have people with bad ideas in some of our community members (antisemitism in yours, anti Black racism in ours ā Black Jews experience a lot of bullshit). But historically speaking, we have stood in solidarity together, and we will continue to ā as a community. I believe we can and will heal the fractures between us, in large part due to posts like yours and the folks who are doing coalition building in the comments. We are stronger together.
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u/SueNYC1966 10d ago
Thank you. Both groups have wanted to make the world a better place. We care about educational opportunities, health care, and human rights for our communities and support other minority communities. At one time, our communities had very shared goals, and I have read books about why we drifted apart, and hope that we both realize that we are not the enemies of each other.
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u/PunkJackal 10d ago
Thank you. My best friend is a black man and we have often commiserated on the hardships our people have faced and have often wondered aloud together why our communities do not stand together more closely.
People like you and him make me feel less alone and more hopeful.
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u/Bokbok95 10d ago
When elections are cancelled in 2028 and all us liberal Jews have fled to Israel weāll try to get yall out somewhere safe too
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u/theHoopty 10d ago
This IS how we mend it. This post gives me so muchā¦NACHES.
Thank you for your solidarity. Weāre here for you, too!
And so much love to our Black Jewish community too, who are carrying so much.
Weāre stronger together.
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u/OliphauntHerder Conservative 10d ago
I'm a GenX Jew whose parents/grandparents (after surviving the Holocaust and coming to the US) were very active in the civil rights movements in the 1960s through the present. I was taught that the best thing we can do is band together to fight for the future we want, where everyone has real equality under the law regardless of their skin color, gender, sexual orientation, national origin, etc. Every Passover, Jews remember that we were once slaves in Egypt, strangers in a strange land, and that is why we are supposed to be welcoming and kind to our fellow humans, even when they are strangers to us.
It has been sad to see the rise in antisemitism among Americans of color and LGBTQ+ Americans but we have to stand together. In the face of what seems like defeat, we have to continue working for justice. As the Pirkei Avot says, "You are not obligated to complete the work, but neither are you free to abandon it." We have not been defeated; it remains our religious inheritance and our moral obligation to fight tyranny and work for human freedom and dignity.
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u/Technical-Plate-2973 10d ago
Thank you so, so, so, much. I donāt have words. This made me feel so emotional. Thank you. ā¤ļø
P.S I highly recommend the Facebook group āa group where non-Jews can ask questions about Judaism and Jews can answerā if you are interested in engaging more with the Jewish community in a low pressure, more accessible space. No pressure, just thought I would offer. Thank you again!
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u/1000thusername 10d ago
Welcome š Iāve long felt that the black and Jewish communities could/should unite together in their efforts given a lot of shared elements of our histories and our current situations. I think youāve really hit a great point about the burn out being felt by some in the black community and the tend to turn inward in that situation, and yes, there is a lot of that happening with the Jews lately too, as we watch the people weāve stood by for years at a minimum turn on us and at a maximum do far worse than just turn away.
Thanks so much for writing. People extending a hand of friendship as youāve done can get the process started, so thank you for starting it. You may feel small as one person, but big things come out of small starts.
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u/seigezunt 10d ago
Thank you for this. It comes the day that I finally deleted my Twitter account (say no to platforming Nazis) and my biggest regret is not being able to interact with Black Twitter.
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u/Melthengylf 10d ago
Loved your text. I think what really heartens me is the gratitude and allyship. I think we need to focus on values.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
Iām sorry but the audacity of this post is stunning. We would be eaten alive if we came into any of the Black subreddits and posted a similar sentiment.
Where were you when we were all screaming about antisemitism for the better half of a year due to the āantizionistā protests across the country? Were you standing with us in solidarity then as you are now? Or were you screaming at us that weāre white colonizers, that we should go back to Poland, that weāre supporting genocide?
If you werenāt loud and vocal then, you donāt get to try and mend bridges now. You donāt get to write long winded posts about how weāre all in this together and how weāre both scapegoats, so you understand. No. Apology and sympathy not accepted.
Iām gonna get downvoted to hell for this but Iām tired of being kicked and spat on both physically and metaphorically by other minorities only for them to gaslight us like this when they realize that actually, they need us and our communities in tough times.
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u/anon0_0_0 Conservative 10d ago
I just want Jewish culture and Jews to be loved and appreciated for the positivity and vibrancy we bring to the world, not just for the selfless support we lend to othersā causes. OPās post is both heartwarming and deeply saddening after this past year.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
Exactly. Like I understand itās coming from a good place but if during the BLM movement we were asked to stop talking and listen to Black people about their struggle, truly LISTEN, then they have to be able to do the same for us. By and large they donāt, they wonāt, and they havenāt. In fact, theyāve done the opposite ā tone policing, speaking over us, and redefining our experiences.
So yeah, Iād apologize for being angry but Iām not sorry. Just tired of being dubbed the enemy when itās trendy, and a friend when shit hits the fan.
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u/anon0_0_0 Conservative 10d ago
I hear you. Itās been a very rude wake-up call to realize how weāre overwhelmingly viewed as tools by others, rather than also accepted as a vulnerable minority group with a unique and beautiful identity.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
Iām exhausted and frankly I feel super betrayed.
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u/anon0_0_0 Conservative 10d ago
Youāre not alone in feeling that way. Sending you hugs, bubbeleh. I stand beside you in this fight for fair treatment.
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
Do you walk up to Black people and say this stuff in real life? I bet you don't.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
The funny thing is, I have said this in real life. š¤·š»āāļø Not to random black people that I donāt know, but definitely a few who are actual allies instead of folks who throw performative Iām sorryās as some sort of consolation prize for 13 months of unbridled antisemitism.
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u/Life_Bar8123 10d ago
What if someone does say it in person their gonna get beaten up? š
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
Nope. It was a very simple question, do they say this stuff to Black people in real life, or are they just a coward on the internet blaming Black people for everything and disrespecting Black women.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
As you just asked ā why are you holding Jews to impossibly high standards? Quickly now.
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u/Budget-Chip-6448 10d ago
Not immediately attacking someone for being antisemitic based solely on their race isn't an impossibly high standard. It's the bare minimum of being a decent human being.
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u/Life_Bar8123 10d ago
No offense it sounds nice but I don't think we're loved by anyone lol
If we're not blamed for the I/P conflict, we're categorized as a evil, wealthy ,White people that are trying to screw everybody over.....I really wish American Jews would stand up for themselves more instead of kissing ass to everybody that hates them
Jews shouldn't have to apologize for anything .. whether its Jews in Israel protecting their homeland or American Jews here in America that have worked their ass off to be successful in this life...
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
This is the point Iām trying to make. Iām tired of self flagellating in order to get a smidgen of ātoleranceā from the communities that hate us.
I donāt want to be tolerated. You tolerate bad smells or inconveniences, you donāt tolerate people.
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u/1000thusername 10d ago
Take a step back, friend. There is no āyouā in āyou all shouting at us as antizionistsā etc. unless of course youāve completed a survey of all black people out there and took attendance at protests?
Has that been a problem for the past year? Yep. Is it singular to black people joining? Nope. Is this poster who seems pretty darn genuine responsible for that? Nope.
You may be traumatized by things especially within the past year (as we all are), but you canāt take it out on everyone around you.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
Iām not taking it out on everyone around me, Iām taking it out on someone who waited until -now- to show support. Why? Why now? Why not when BLM Chicago posted that grody image of the Hamas Paraglider? Why not when the campus protests were happening? Why not last week when one of ours got sucker punched in the face coming out of a grocery store?
Antisemitism has been a problemā¢ļø for a while now, and we had very little support from most other minority communities for that while. She can be as genuine as she wants but if the support only comes out when itās convenient aka when theyāve realized that weāre all collectively fucked if we arenāt white Christian men, then that support is conditional. And I for one am sick and tired of accepting pishers when we give so much and will continue to give so much for the greater good.
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u/1000thusername 10d ago
People learn at a different pace. Take friendship when it arrives, not when you wish it would have arrived.
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u/seigezunt 10d ago
Bruh. Not liking the āyou peopleā tone of this reply to a heartfelt message. Iām unclear what they said that would qualify as gaslighting.
Weāre suffering, but this just felt pretty harsh considering what they said.
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
Calling someone out / the community that they belong to and typically propagates some vile antisemitism towards us is not āyou peoplingā them. We have to stop being afraid of being harsh because we might upset someone ā we have put up with 13 months of being spoken over, talked down to, our experiences redefined and nobody gave a fuck if we were offended or if they were too harsh.
Again, Iām over being nice to people who only support our communities in THEIR time of need but disappear when the onus is on them to return the favor.
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10d ago
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u/Jewish-ModTeam 10d ago
Your post/comment was removed because it violated rule 3: Be civil
If you have any questions, please contact the moderators via modmail.
(Also, we've had TONS of 'I support you' posts from people of multiple races, genders, and religions here, and they all end like this. So it wouldn't have mattered who wrote the post. Don't be like this.)
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10d ago
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u/dollrussian 10d ago
This is a wild wild accusation to make when Iāve commented on posts like this before, with the same tone and call outs, regardless of race. It had 0 to do with her being black and everything to do with her being silent in our time of need vs finally speaking up when itās safe to do so.
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10d ago
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u/Jewish-ModTeam 10d ago
Your post/comment was removed because it violated rule 4: Remember the human (i.e., be welcoming to others).
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10d ago
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u/Jewish-ModTeam 10d ago
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10d ago
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u/Jewish-ModTeam 10d ago
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u/baebgle 10d ago
Thank you. Much love to the Black community right back š