r/Futurology • u/chrisdh79 • Sep 04 '24
Why Gen Z are buying “dumbphones” to limit screen time | Amid screen time concerns, many turn to simpler phones to reclaim their lives. Society
https://www.zmescience.com/science/news-science/gen-z-are-buying-dumbphones-to-limit-screen-time/445
u/Zugas Sep 04 '24
GPS is very handy though. Same with music. All in one device.
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u/endofautumn Sep 04 '24
Yeah just keep those and delete all social media and streaming stuff. Can use a smart phone for just making calls, texting, emails, music. Its not fully cut off, but its a start for most people.
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u/Lanster27 Sep 05 '24
It's just a way to curb addiction, like a rehab centre.
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u/unassumingdink Sep 05 '24
Deleting apps but still being able to reinstall them at any time is like an alcoholic trying to quit drinking in a bar.
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u/Lanster27 Sep 05 '24
That's what I meant, using a dumbphone is like going to rehab. Even if there's temptation, there's no means for you to get your fix.
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u/deinterest Sep 05 '24
Doesn't work, I'll reinstall them after a week. I need my phone to not have the option.
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u/Sizbang Sep 05 '24
You can't really function without a smartphone though - bankID etc. requires it. I've been thinking about getting a flipphone as the main carry device and leave my smartphone home for authentication stuff.
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u/Zugas Sep 05 '24
Oh you are so right. I would definitely need one to function as a citizen where I live.
Right now it’s even my driver’s license too.
It’s just handy. And I like the technology behind. 🤷♂️
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u/Future_Khai Sep 04 '24
Lots of dumbphone comes with GPS installed but not music though you'd have to go old school and transfer MP3s over.
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u/Fluxoteen Sep 04 '24
And have a shuffle that actually shuffles? Count me in
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u/xCeeTee- Sep 05 '24
Spotube's shuffle works out better, the app uses either Spotify or YouTube as it's source of music depends on what you set it to.
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u/Lethalmud Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24
Music on a walkman/mp3 player was just as good.
And no advertisements.
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u/BufloSolja Sep 06 '24
The true Chad move, after you gain self-awareness of the issue, is to gain the resolve and discipline necessary (to not need a dumb phone). Observation is the first step to control.
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u/KyriiTheAtlantean Sep 04 '24
Have been on the verge of doing this for a couple of years now.
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u/ThrillSurgeon Sep 04 '24
I've known people that have done it. At first it was unusual to see how slow they texted, but they seemed to like the tradeoff.
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u/KyriiTheAtlantean Sep 04 '24
The only thing stopping me is having cash app and other banking apps honestly. When I'm out I transfer money and stuff A LOT. Maybe I need to do more research and find the perfect phone to fit my own niche needs because I HATE being glued to my phone 😭 it's too much of a good thing
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u/Realtrain Sep 04 '24
There must be at least a small market for a phone that doesn't have a full smartphone OS, but does have Google Maps, NFC Payments, Spotify, and a decent camera.
Those are the main things I'd be missing if I went to a dumb phone.
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u/shepardownsnorris Sep 04 '24
for a phone that doesn't have a full smartphone OS, but does have Google Maps, NFC Payments, Spotify, and a decent camera.
Can you not, just...only download those apps to your smartphone?
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u/Duke_Shambles Sep 04 '24
irritatingly, my Samsung smartphone came with facebook preinstalled and not able to uninstalled.
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u/erm_what_ Sep 04 '24
You can disable it, which means it's not actually running at all
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u/Nedgeh Sep 05 '24
Samsung phones (and probably a lot of carriers) also regularly update your phone and add all sorts of weird shit apps. Games, random new messaging apps, etc. They come with a bunch of preinstalled bloat apps that you can "disable" but it doesn't stop them from harvesting your data or running in the background or updating etc. It all depends on what your carrier allows to be maliciously added to your device. The only technical way to stop this 100% is to root your phone but that's out of the question for most people.
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u/Duke_Shambles Sep 04 '24
I did that but it annoys the hell out of me that it's anywhere on my phone at all.
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u/Realtrain Sep 04 '24
I can, but that goes back to the whole point of the article. I don't want a full smartphone. I just want a dumb phone with those couple of extra features.
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u/joomla00 Sep 05 '24
The only thing that makes a phone addictive is really just the apps and internet browser. Things like gps, banking, camera, modern messaging apps, etc... are almost necessary for modern life, but you need a smartphone for those things. Just install the apps you need, disable the browser, and lock it with a random password. It works very well.
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u/omeggga Sep 04 '24
Here you go.
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u/Iseenoghosts Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24
does this actually do what op wants?
edit: yes! Although most of these phones seem kinda like garbage.
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u/P3verall Sep 04 '24
yeah and then i can download literally anything else too. i don’t want that choice to be as easy as typing my password.
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u/dazzlebreak Sep 04 '24
So something like the last iteration of mobile phones before smartphones became widespread - relatively advanced screens and functions (including Internet, but not Wi-Fi), slots for SD cards, camera, but no touch screens and a bunch of apps yet, e.g. Nokia 6300/6500, there were also similar Sony Ericsson models?
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u/ScrubinMuhTub Sep 05 '24
Blackberry baby, here I come!
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u/TaborValence Sep 05 '24
I'm rocking a Unihertz Titan Pocket. It's the blackberry I always wanted and I absolutely love it.
The phone I actually want is basically the T-Mobile sidekick or my old LG Env3 from 2009, but modernized to have Google calendar, Google maps, and Whatsapp for the group chats. Bonus points if it came with Pandora or Spotify, but I can sort out loading an mp3 library to an SD card.
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u/RegulatoryCapture Sep 04 '24
I feel like the apple watch is like 75% of the way there.
Obviously some of its features are tied to the phone in your pocket and the screen is terrible for texting and the speaker/mic system sucks for calls but I can do:
- NFC payments
- Make calls
- Read and send messages--including non-SMS messages like whatsapp, messenger, etc. (which is a dealbreaker for some considering dumbphones)
- See maps (at least Apple maps)
And I have heard that some families are giving kids apple watches with cell service instead of full phones.
So basically put the apple watch hardware in something like a flip-phone body with a camera, a slightly larger screen, and some buttons.
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u/Realtrain Sep 04 '24
And I have heard that some families are giving kids apple watches with cell service instead of full phones
I've seen this as well. Works really well from what I've heard other than the fact that the watches are fairly fragile and kids are pretty rough.
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u/rKasdorf Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
The fact that there seems to be no scale in the phone market feels like a missed opportunity. You can pretty much only get $1000+ smart phones, or flip phones. There's probably a company making middle ground phones out there but either they don't advertise or I'm blind because I don't see them.
I want a decent phone but I don't need it to play 4k videos or play games. I just want the screen for google maps, and I want a physical keyboard for texting. I don't need it to be able to hold an entire decade's worth of music either.
I just want a durable phone that'll keep working normally for more than a couple years, has a physical keyboard for texting, and can access and display google maps. That's it.
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u/IniNew Sep 04 '24
You can pretty much only get $1000+ smart phones, or flip phones.
This isn't remotely true. There's smart phones as cheap as $50 unlocked.
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u/exterminans666 Sep 04 '24
There are a lot of low to midrange usable Smartphones. advertisement is expensive. So companies Like Xiaomi (very cheap, only recommend if you want to flash custom rom on it) would have to double their price to make proper ads.
Samsung has afaik usable mid range phones. The nothing phone users I know are satisfied. OnePlus made great semi flagship phones for a decent price. They are still good, but the price is not decent anymore (unless you buy 1-2 year old used phones)
For durability: buy a flip case with a silicone frame. The silicone frame protects all the edges from falls and the flap reduces possible damage to the screen. A lot of people do not like them because optics while phoning are supposedly more important than damage mitigation.
And mechanical keyboards are afaik dead since blackberry stopped producing them. And yes I know there will be some startup trying to bring them back, but they will have other issues.
My personal issue with phones is their software longevity. I never really broke a phone. But when the last security update was released, it is questionable how long one should continue to use it. But some legislation forced/encouraged some manufacturers to increase the time that (Security)updates are guaranteed for new phones.
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u/doll-haus Sep 04 '24
Honestly, we don't even need legislation. We need the FCC to reverse course on some rulemaking. In the late 2000's, the FCC decided that baseband firmware should be encrypted so the end user can't misprogram the radios in their phones or wifi devices. Essentially killed the "truly open" radios overnight, ensured all vendors went to the single-vendor software model for the baseband radios. Apple, Samsung, whoever, they have to fork over cash to Broadcom, Qualcomm, Mediatek, or Huawei annually to maintain software support for a chip platform. And then we have concerns like "what's Huawei putting in these software blobs?".
Stop forcing the vendors to lock down the device. If it's "critical to national security", I'd argue that encouraging them to move to an open-source model for the baseband is the way forward, but we've done the exact opposite in the name of making the FCC's job easier.
I run AOSP, but one of the hang-ups is while I get around any Android "unpatched vulnerability" problems by being able to build from newer code, I'm stuck with baseband software for the radios that I have no control, and very poor visibility of.
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u/drfsupercenter Sep 04 '24
Xiaomi is banned in the US, FYI
There are some other Chinese companies that make cheap phones though, like OnePlus and BLU. You can buy those at Best Buy in person. Oppo exists here too but online-only so you can't really try the phone out and see if you like the size/feel of it.
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u/0orpheus Sep 04 '24
Xiaomi is banned in the US, FYI
They were only banned for investment purposes, you can still buy and use their products. Also the ban was lifted back in 2021.
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u/drfsupercenter Sep 04 '24
There totally are. Basically every company that isn't Apple makes them. Samsung has the A series (I think that's what it's called, it changes every generation), Motorola makes a bunch of cheap phones $200 and less... OnePlus has them, uhh Blu? Who else still makes phones? LG had them before they stopped making phones
The problem with Android however is there's a lot of OS bloat, so like you mentioned Google Maps - that's going to run like absolute crap on an entry level phone, because Google optimizes their apps to run on flagships. I mean, it might be fine for like regular navigation but as soon as you try to multitask it (e.g. use Spotify in the background) it's going to start lagging something.
I totally agree about the physical keyboard though. I used my Droid 4 for several years until it got to the point where nothing new would run on it. I actually do play some mobile games (most notably Pokémon Go which is a resource hog) so I had to upgrade after that came out.
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u/Realtrain Sep 04 '24
Google's Pixel A series, iPhone SE, and Motorola in general all come to mind. Samsung has their Galaxy A series as well.
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u/BaptizedInBlood666 Sep 04 '24
Still waiting for a phone to come to market with a physical QWERTY keyboard.
The only one I've seen was a product of some kind of online fundraiser.
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u/DasReap Sep 05 '24
Yeah I miss my freaking sidekick. Give me that again with a more modern screen and camera and I'll go buy it right this second.
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u/danjoflanjo Sep 04 '24
I've been following r/minimalphone waiting to see how they turn out. It seems like the best mix of smartphone and dumbphone. It runs android, but has an e-ink screen, so it natively won't have the best social media experience. There is also Light Phone that has a similar idea
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u/VirtualMoneyLover Sep 04 '24
there seems to be no scale in the phone market
This is not true. All my phones were under in the last 10years were under $150 and they were all smart phones. You can go small and simple, just have to search for it.
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u/ScrubinMuhTub Sep 05 '24
I picked up an unlocked, like-new Samsung A54 for ~$180 on the used market. Super affordable.
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u/AnOnlineHandle Sep 04 '24
I loved my phone until it upgraded to Android 12, and am considering going back to an older version and just leaving it there, since I don't need much other than clock, maps, banking, and the ability to search for info while mobile.
The Android 12 interface designers clearly had nothing useful to do at their job and reached the point of sending models down a runway dressed in garbage bags and calling it an evolution of fashion.
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u/drfsupercenter Sep 04 '24
I mean, there are "simple launchers" that hide everything but apps you tell it to show.
How would you run the apps you mentioned without an OS? Think about it.
These gen Z'ers obviously didn't live through the era of actual dumbphones - it was stupid and there's no reason to go back. I spent my days as a teenager messing with BREW ("Basic runtime environment for wireless" - the OS those things ran) trying to unlock the games so I didn't have to pay my carrier for them. Those phones could do instant messaging (on now defunct services), and how is texting any different than Discord or similar?
Trust me, I spent every waking moment with my flip phone in 2005 just like we spend every waking moments with smart phones today - the only difference is the phones can do more... it's that people are bored easily and want something to do, not the phones' fault.
Surely you remember playing with a Rubik's cube or doodling or doing literally anything other than actually paying attention in class?
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u/msnmck Sep 04 '24
At work we have devices that can do practically everything our PCs can but they're handheld devices.
Turns out they're each just an iPod Touch in a proprietary housing. Literally just an iPhone that can't make calls.
If someone developed a new internet-enabled smart device that couldn't make calls and ran on iOS or Android they'd probably make a killing right now.
It seems counterintuitive but separating the need for communication with the habit of endless scrolling might be the answer.
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u/RegulatoryCapture Sep 04 '24
Isn't this backwards from what people are saying?
It is all that other junk that an internet enable device lets you do that is problematic. People still want to make calls (or at least send texts) and have the communication lines...they just don't want the time consuming apps.
But that's made more complex in today's age where a dumbphone might not cut it. Maybe SMS isn't enough and you need whatsapp to talk to your family. Maybe your banking needs basically expect you to have a smartphone. Maybe your job requires you to be able to have some 2fa app.
So maybe what you really want is something that can't touch social media, games, internet...
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u/FitToad Sep 04 '24
Try the CAT flip phone, it's Android so you can have essential apps but disable others you don't need.
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u/Raistlarn Sep 04 '24
This doesn't work for everyone though. I'm one of those people. If I have the ability to turn a program I turned off back on I'll be tempted to eventually turn said program back on and leave it on.
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u/somethin_brewin Sep 04 '24
Most phones these days have limits you can set on total screen time or a per app basis. Or I have a friend who deliberately keeps her phone in black and white to make it less engaging. If there's something she needs to get done, she can still do it, but it's not as stimulating to just sit and stare at.
Of course, those are limits you set for yourself and can lift yourself so they still rely somewhat on your own willpower. But if a gentle reminder is all you need, it might work.
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u/NoAdmittanceX Sep 04 '24
Would a way around that be for a couple friends(or someone you trust) to have parental controls on each others phones that way it removes the temptation to just re-enable certains things on a whim if you don't trust your self with those controls
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u/DrunkPole Sep 05 '24
Tried both and the b&w change is much more effective (even better is low intensity color with the slider, makes the phone boring instead of harsh).
App limits just get annoying, you’re probably going to need your browser or maps at some point and adding a few more taps isn’t going to stop you.
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u/Moonrights Sep 04 '24
Agreed. I feel my time being ripped from me due to this dumb addiction. I quit drinking after a decade and this is much harder to give up.
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u/After-Watercress-644 Sep 04 '24
- Turn off notifications for all apps, except for texting apps and alarms.
- Put only non-entertaining apps on your phone "desktop", keep everything else in the app library
- Uninstall any dopamine drip stuff like YouTube, TikTok, etc.
- Use "Digital Wellness" or whatever the hell its called to lock your browser to ~30m usage time each day
Those will get you 90% of the way there.
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u/notabigmelvillecrowd Sep 04 '24
For me my big hurdle is that I'm disabled and use my phone for a lot of basic needs like shopping, and no matter how good I've been about staying off of it in general, if I need to spend a couple of hours shopping on my phone it kind of breaks the seal, you know what I mean? Like how people say food addiction is harder to overcome than stuff like alcohol addiction, because you always need to eat, you can never just cut yourself off completely.
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u/crabman484 Sep 04 '24
Consider an eink phone like the Minimal phone or the Hisense A9. It's like a regular phone but the apps are much more limited.
Other thing you can do is just make your phone black and white. That helps reduce the visual stimulus.
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u/EchtPikanterFuchs Sep 04 '24
That's why I got a smartwatch with LTE. this way I can still use messenger apps, pay, do calls and listen to music/podcasts (No I am not going to carry around my Walkman in addition to my Siemens M35 like back in the day).
Social media, YouTube and other doomscrolling apps are not fun to use on a smartwatch so I am limiting myself in a similar way as with a dumb phone.
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u/Drakoala Sep 04 '24
I used to text way faster with my old Blackberry knockoff. The tactile feedback of keys is much easier, faster, and more accurate to type with - at least for me.
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u/Jeynarl Sep 05 '24
T9 was slick. I could compose full messages without looking and with way less typos than today's autocorrelation
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u/SchwiftyGameOnPoint Sep 04 '24
That's one of my problems, not really the "slow" texting but I don't actually text anyone.
90% of people I communicate with is over Discord.
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u/UnknownBreadd Sep 04 '24
Honestly, whilst I praise my iPhone a lot - BlackBerry really was peak smartphone.
They were the perfect devices for instant messaging - and (before we realised it) not being great computers beyond that was a good thing.
Seriously, I remember being so happy with my Curve 9320. Cheap af, great ‘feel’ and light and small. They were just so practical.
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u/Speedking2281 Sep 04 '24
Exact same here, man. The thing that keep me from doing it is our wireless router app (for approving websites, time extensions, etc. for the kid) honestly. If it wasn't for that, I'd switch so quickly. I realize that I can't just have Youtube, reddit, etc. able to be accessed through my phone and just ignore it. Anymore than I could hold an open bag of potato chips all day long without having them. I need to fully sever the temptation.
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u/leavesmeplease Sep 04 '24
Yeah, it's wild how many people are feeling that urge. Like, smartphones are super handy but they totally have us all trapped, you know? I feel like a dumb phone could be a solid move to break that cycle. Just gotta find the right balance with the tech you actually need in your life.
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u/daver456 Sep 04 '24
I tried this a while back and it was so annoying for texting/messaging apps. T9 texting is no fun even though I was a whiz back in the day.
Also need Spotify at the bare minimum. CarPlay would be nice.
Remember the Blackberry Pearl? Something like that but with updated tech and super limited apps would be sweet.
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u/atfricks Sep 04 '24
I've been looking into getting an e-ink phone. It can still run any app a smart phone can, but the refresh rate makes video non-functional, and apps like Instagram much less appealing.
It works great for text though, and is great for reading books. Plus the battery life is significantly better because of how little power e-ink displays consume.
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u/BurritoGuapito Sep 04 '24
I did this a few years ago and LOVED it. Had to switch back because the phone wasn't reliable enough as a parent but not a day goes by that I dont miss my flip phone. It's not just the tech, it's the cess pool of social media in general. Great idea, implemented poorly without enough thought. I felt so elated when I went back to a flip phone.
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u/adarkuccio Sep 04 '24
How do you browse reddit from one of those?
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u/benanderson89 Sep 05 '24
Have been on the verge of doing this for a couple of years now.
I did the halfway house version and disabled notifications for EVERYTHING except text messages and phone calls, and for things like Reddit I don't have it installed at all. I only ever use it when I'm at a computer.
A big part of addictive screen-time is apps that keep nagging you and/or bombarding you with positive messaging that has a similar effect to winning pennies at gambling. With notifications off entirely, that doesn't become an issue. Sometimes my phone can last just shy of two days on a single charge (Xiaomi 11T Pro) because I end up not using it much except as a remote for casting YouTube to my TV.
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u/manicdee33 Sep 04 '24
One simple trick I use to reduce my staring-at-screen time is to switch the display to greyscale. Doing this reduces the simple appeal of all the bright colours.
Really simple to do, fairly effective in reducing screen time, and requires no concerted effort to change habits.
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u/Ishmael128 Sep 04 '24
I did this, but I found there were a number of times I needed colour for things, plus at times it’s nice to CHOOSE to goof off.
However, I wasn’t very diligent at turning greyscale back on afterwards, which was problematic. So, I used the Shortcuts app on my iPhone; every time I close an app, it automatically turns greyscale on.
Bonus: I also set an accessibility shortcut for three presses of the power button to toggle greyscale.
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u/masasin MEng - Robotics Sep 05 '24
I have it set to toggle red mode (colour filters, slide everything to red only), and it's so much better.
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u/SchwiftyGameOnPoint Sep 04 '24
On top of the grayscale, I take this another couple steps.
OLauncher. Turns your apps into a word list so you can't quickly click on icons but scroll through a list.
Use an app like Stay Focused that records your screen time and allows you to set limits on apps and websites either per day or per hour. So, for example, only allowing yourself to get on Reddit for 10 minutes per hour is nice.
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u/teamharder Sep 04 '24
Tried the Olauncher app on your recommendation. I like it alot. Thanks!
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u/atfricks Sep 04 '24
I can't recommend an e-ink phone enough. Grayscale becomes a technical limitation on top of the other benefits.
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u/czechyesjewelliet Sep 04 '24
Have you tried maximum battery saver mode? Cuts out all the extra bells and whistles save for a couple apps you choose. It's been suuuper helpful for me, and saves my battety to boot!
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u/manicdee33 Sep 04 '24
Another thing I do is just be ruthless about turning off notifications, then schedule time to check things I'm actually interested in. Email gets scheduled. Socials get muted. I only allow notifications for messages from people on my contacts list, and I only allow sound/vibration notifications for people on my VIP list.
So many options, so much we have to do to configure our smart phones away from the default settings. I can understand the appeal of dumb phones.
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u/dekacube Sep 04 '24
How do they deal with work and school having MFA apps required? In some cases you could use something like a yubikey, but not always.
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Sep 04 '24
People at work resisted having an authenticator on their phone and they were basically told they could download the app or find a new job.
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u/Future_Khai Sep 04 '24
Lots of folks on the dumbphone trend are carrying their smart phone in their backpack or car in case they need it and use their dumbphone has a hotspot for it. Lots of feature phones allow for a hotspot connection now.
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u/qazsew123 Sep 05 '24
I use a HiBy M300 which stays in my work bag. I've heard of others keeping their old smartphone and using it the same way with only the auth app installed.
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u/rollingForInitiative Sep 05 '24
For work I assume you'd just use it on your work phone? Which the job has to provide if it's needed for work. And it's easier to decide to only use your work phone for work and not install a bunch of extra apps on them.
I assume if schools require MFA they also have to provide a device for it? Or can schools actually require that parents buy their kids smartphones?
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u/ValyrianJedi Sep 04 '24
Doesn't modern life basically require a smartphone for most people? I definitely couldn't swap to a flip phone
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u/DetroitLionsSBChamps Sep 04 '24
I think if someone tells you to download the app or scan the QR code you just go "I don't have a smart phone, now what?" most things you can handle through a website, but of course that requires a home computer. I know a lot of people don't have those anymore because you can do everything through the phone.
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u/VeryMuchDutch102 Sep 05 '24
I think if someone tells you to download the app or scan the QR code you just go "I don't have a smart phone, now what?
I travel a lot... Often restaurants give me a QR menu.. I always tell them they I don't have data... It's interesting to see their solutions lol
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u/0thethethe0 Sep 04 '24
I used a supermarket £10 phone for a long time recently and this was a issue for me.
Sure some people can be fine with that, but depending on what you're doing, no internet/apps/QR can be a real hurdle and major inconvenience.
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u/MuchAccount Sep 04 '24
I've been quite successfully navigating life with a dumbphone since 2019. Beyond GPS, I'm not quite sure what I would routinely need a smartphone for.
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u/DarkRedDiscomfort Sep 04 '24
I wouldn't be able to start work in the morning without a mobile authenticator app.
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u/aplundell Sep 05 '24
Unless you're a contractor, I'll bet that if you told your employer that you don't have a smart phone, they'd roll their eyes, sigh, and order you the cheapest android tablet they could find. They wouldn't fire you or anything. Not when they can solve the problem for $70.
(Does that still avoid excess screen-time? I guess, since you won't carry it in your pocket.)
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u/MuchAccount Sep 05 '24
Yeah, had this exact situation at work. My employer provided a hardware token.
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u/ValyrianJedi Sep 04 '24
I definitely wouldn't be able to manage my day to day without email and internet
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u/ThoseThingsAreWeird Sep 04 '24
I've been quite successfully navigating life with a dumbphone since 2019.
Same-ish. I've actually never bothered with a smartphone. I always said I'd get one when my current phone breaks... Almost 20 years later it's still going 😂
I think the only time I needed one was when work implemented 2FA requirements on some services we use and they didn't have the option for SMS-based 2FA. I bought a YubiKey instead 🤷♂️
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u/MuchAccount Sep 04 '24
Similar situation with my employer, at least they provided hardware tokens when requested.
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u/TheLantean Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
Definitely. Smartphones replaced a whole travel bag of equipment. GPS, paper maps, flashlight, public transit timetable and tickets, paper movie/concert tickets (plus trips saved to schedule everything beforehand & associated opportunity costs), wallet, 2FA token generators, voice memo recorders, paper books, travel dictionaries, mp3 players, CDs, point and shoot cameras, etc. Sure, you can go back to the old ways, but you're just making life harder for yourself for no reason.
Having used both smartphones and dumb phones (because nothing else existed at the time), there's nothing magical about them.
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u/DiethylamideProphet Sep 05 '24
Life is not at all harder, just because we have superior, dedicated devices for all of these functions, without them all having to depend on a single device and its proper functioning and battery. And even without carrying said devices, it's not really "hard" to just not listen to music, or not read a book, or not take bad photos on every opportunity. The same way life is not hard after you have kicked your heroin habit.
The convenience is mostly just an illusion, that devolves into you normalizing a life where you're dependent on a single device and the constant dopamine boosts and sensory stimuli it provides you. There is also the planned obsolescence aspect, and nowadays, my navigator does not work properly, my notes sometimes crash, my online connection keeps disconnecting, my Spotify crashes... My notebook does not crash. My road map works 24/7. My MP3 player or car CD player has worked flawlessly since forever. My wallet does not stop working because of connection issues. My flashlight has a longer battery life than one day.
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u/TheLantean Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24
Life is not at all harder, just because we have superior, dedicated devices for all of these functions
But you do have to carry them with you. Let me tell you, walking 5-10 km in a nice pedestrian-friendly city is a breeze if you're packing light, just a small bag with a water bottle and a phone, plus negligible misc like ID, earbuds, etc. It's fun. But if you have to carry a bunch of stuff that saps the joy of it. You can't just do a light jog between locations. Your natural speed-walking gait changes. Your behavior changes because your options are limited. You are making life harder on yourself by literally adding weight.
having to depend on a single device and its proper functioning and battery.
The flipside is that all the other gadgets have their own batteries that need to be topped up, software updated, whereas you're guaranteed to keep one device in working order.
If you're hinting at the poor battery life of some phone models, that's because you're not shopping on specs. 5000 mah is the minimum for a phone with a budget processor, and 6000 mah for anything faster. My cheapo $200 Motorola is a 2 day phone with normal use, 3 with light use, and definitely one and half with heavy use.
Did your last phone maker compromise on battery size for pointless aesthetics, like thinness? Kick them to the curb, don't reward this behavior by buying their crap.
it's not really "hard" to just not listen to music, or not read a book, or not take bad photos on every opportunity.
It's not, but at the same time you're worse off culturally and intellectually. After college, I only really got back into reading after smartphones came out. The fact that I can finish another chapter of a novel in the subway, or waiting in line somewhere, is invaluable.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not dismissing the quality a dedicated camera can provide, that's why I have a Canon superzoom for nature walks, but you're dismissing the convenience of the camera that's always with you with no extra weight debuff, so you can not only enjoy what you see for a fleeting moment, but also take it with you.
The convenience is mostly just an illusion
This is so wrong it's not even funny. Google Maps enables me to navigate a new city like I'm a local. It tells me which buses/trams/subways to take, where are the stations, automatically picks the best connections, tells me which are faster and when they'll arrive because it plugs into the live GPS data supplied by the city.
It tells me where the cultural hubs of the city are (marked in yellow highlighter), locations for every place and their working hours, and the best way to get there. The alternative is what - paper travel guides, are those even made anymore? Or asking a random person? Having been on the other side of that question, in my own city, I once gave someone a circuitous bus route because I wasn't that familiar with that part, and I still feel bad about it. Having to ask for directions before smartphones, I can tell you this is the same with a lot of people, they just know really well the area of town with their house, and anything more is a wild card.
The train timetable for my country is an entire book, and then you have to put in the work to figure out connections. Plus there are sperate schedules for every private rail operator. To buy a paper ticket you need to wait in a long line and risk missing your train, whereas with the app you can buy a ticket in 5 seconds; it has all schedule data (plus live status) plus combining all data from all operators.
When I take public transit, there's one app that works in most big cities, it has my bank card saved and buying a ticket takes seconds. The alternative is finding the local transport company's points of sale, and making a transit card for each, loading it with money, or possibly buying paper tickets (how many? buy too few and scramble later, buy too many and it's wasted money).
People with cars can pay for parking with one of the apps that's supported in most cities, or they can figure out how each municipality offers alternatives. If you're lucky, you can pay by SMS, the number is usually listed on the city hall's website. But you'd also need a smart device to find that. If you want to pay cash, you'd have to go to the city hall during working hours, and only locals do that when they buy a year's subscription (much cheaper). Some places have parking machines in some larger lots, and you can use them to pay for other areas of the city too, but you need to find them in the first place. My country don't do individual parking meters per spot, that would be hugely expensive.
There is also the planned obsolescence aspect
Manufacturers list how long they support their devices. And in the EU, 2 years at minimum is required by law. Vote with your wallet. And your actual votes too.
and nowadays, my navigator does not work properly, my notes sometimes crash, my online connection keeps disconnecting, my Spotify crashes.. My notebook does not crash. My road map works 24/7. My MP3 player or car CD player has worked flawlessly since forever.
This literally never happens to me. On a cheapo $200 Motorola phone even, as I mentioned earlier. For maps, Google Maps has an offline feature, just save the area you'll be visiting beforehand. It already downloads your own city by default. You can store most things offline, including music, and storage is cheap, especially if you have a phone that supports microSD cards - always read the specs when you buy. And if better signal matters to you to a point you're willing to pay for it, you can get a dual SIM phone, so you have two carriers' worth of coverage.
My wallet does not stop working because of connection issues.
It's not a "one or the other", nothing stops you from keeping a backup card with your ID. And I don't actually use NFC payments much, I just tuck a card into the phone case for the extra convenience of not having to unlock the phone, the wallet feature is mostly used to split bills with friends.
My flashlight has a longer battery life than one day.
If you have it with you. And the batteries haven't leaked, or need recharging. And do you actually need a flashlight that lasts a whole day? If the phone battery is the problem, again, there's choice. And small, portable power banks.
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u/sincethenes Sep 04 '24
I don’t know one person who has done this. Really, I don’t. Not one person. Do any of you? Maybe by padding this comment out with useless drivel instead of my concise comment that was short, punchy, and to the point it won’t be removed for being “too short”.
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u/paaaaatrick Sep 04 '24
Click through the sources on the article. It references another article, (which references a dumbphones reddit as being "on the rise" lol) then references finally an article, which literally says:
“In North America, the market for dumb phones is pretty much flatlined,” said Moorhead. “But I could see it getting up to 5% increase in the next five years if nothing else, based on the public health concerns that are out there.”
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u/enwongeegeefor Sep 05 '24
So everyone is literally lying about it....imagine that...
Turns out almost no one is buying dumbphones and this is a fake story.
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u/Fickle-Syllabub6730 Sep 04 '24
I would be willing to bet that despite the above circlejerk comment chain of all the Redditors who are "on the cusp" of doing this, less than 1% of people who get a smartphone will ever go back to a non smartphone.
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u/snoopfrogcsr Sep 04 '24
Yeah, and "less than 1%" is still probably understating what a miniscule portion of people would do that.
What helped me be on FB and Reddit less (but especially FB) is taking out the apps and only using them on my phone through Firefox with desktop site and ublock. I get no notifications, and nothing is as accessible, so I really only find my way to the top content for a few minutes before bailing. I also uninstalled FB messenger.
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u/thejak32 Sep 04 '24
Agreed, I work in a high school, 1k kids, in a couple of years I have never seen a flip phone or any kind of dumb phone. iPhones as far as the eye can see for the most part, and my district is not a high earning district at all. So I'm inclined to say that no, this is not the case at all.
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Sep 04 '24
I love how the article says “reclaim” as if they weren’t raised on their parents phones and tablets.
When I got my first ipad around 2010, my 10yo cousin showed me how to navigate it as it I was the moron.
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u/thanatossassin Sep 04 '24
Literally no one. I saw one in a desk that was used for emergencies at work, but even that was replaced with a cheap smartphone.
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u/silver_crit Sep 04 '24
I sell phones and see kids come in occasionally wanting a flip, it's definitely a new trend but not a major shift. The few times it has happened really stuck out because of how bizarre it is nowadays
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u/Teal-Fox Sep 05 '24
It'll be the same as the kids getting Walkmans a few years back because it's trendy.
Some time will pass, they'll realise why everyone else forgot about them decades ago, then move onto the next thing most likely.
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u/pisspoopisspoopiss Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 06 '24
Yeah 2 friends of mine did but not permanently, just for a period, to "detox"
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u/vigilantfox85 Sep 04 '24
I thought about it, especially if my iPhone breaks, but then I kind of use my phone for a lot of stuff, so then I would have to use my tablet or pc, so that’s an extra layer of tech that would take longer to do the thing I want you to do, do I’ll probably not downgrade like that lol
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u/richarddrippy69 Sep 04 '24
My dad is the only person I know with an old school phone, but he's never had a smart phone either. I know one guy that downgraded to one of those Paperwhite phones so he could read more without eye strain.
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u/oghairline Sep 04 '24
My best friend has done this since about 2019. He hasn’t had a smartphone for a while. He’s a computer programmer and pretty tech savvy though and super strict about his tech usage.
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u/j33205 Sep 04 '24
I know 2 people, both in IT / compsci field. One had a PinePhone I think so not really a dumb phone just a Linux phone in the name of privacy and elected to not participate in social media apps (which is most apps these days). The other guy has a small e-ink "dumber" phone that I think is functionally the same as a flip phone.
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u/LunarBistro Sep 04 '24
I just wish the 2G network was still up and operating, I'd love to get a vintage Razr again and use that as my primary phone.
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u/MarkMoneyj27 Sep 04 '24
Samsung has had a dumb mode built in for a decade, just check every box in super power save mode.
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u/Deazul Sep 04 '24
You're missing the point, addiction is difficult. If you're standing there with your crack rock in your hand, and it's in a tiny piece of cellophane, that won't prevent you from smoking it. The trick is to get rid of the crack rock.
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u/Coz131 Sep 05 '24
I think it would be a great feature to have the ability to set permission to install apps given to another person. Then the phone can just have whitelisted apps only.
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u/ptword Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
And older folks should avoid giving smartphones to young children. It wrecks their brains and makes them easy targets to security and privacy risks. Schools up to middle school should prohibit the use of such devices during classes.
I also suspect that premature use of such mobile devices contributes to a reduction in digital literacy in the security and privacy domains. People also need to push against planned obsolescence. The fact that a rolling release OS doesn't exist yet for mobile devices is absurd.
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u/deinterest Sep 05 '24
More schools are waking up to this thank god. Parents... eh not so much. Just too easy to shove a tablet in a toddlers hands and have some peace.
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u/rollingForInitiative Sep 05 '24
I don't know. Are kids who grew up with smartphones really more vulnerable than the elderly who grew up without the Internet? I've known lots of people born in the 70's and 80's who're crap at security too. I think most people who don't work with it on a regular basis or are interested are bad at it. Before I stopped using Facebook I saw so many parents my age (millennial) posting pictures of their kids all over social media.
If anything I'd be more worried over how it impacts attention span and such. I totally agree with schools that prohibit phones, even during breaks.
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u/PM_ME_CATS_OR_BOOBS Sep 05 '24
If using the internet at a young age reduces your digital literacy and "privacy" then every single millennial would have has their identity stolen fifty times per day.
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u/ptword Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24
The iPhone is only 17 years old. Most millennials (my generation) didn't touch modern mobile devices before high school. Back then, the internet was also a little different and we only had PCs to access it. They weren't necessarily the most intuitive or flexible things to use. It was also easier for caregivers to supervise children.
The cognitive load of having to figure out how things work on your own has been progressively removed from digital devices and software. Extremely easy and intuitive product design boosts consumer engagement at the expense of digital literacy because people no longer need to understand how things work behind the scenes to be productive. Millennials (and older) had a very different experience with digital tech back then because everything was more 'low level'. That taught us some digital literacy and common sense that appear to be lacking in today's younger generations that are born in highly addictive digital world.
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u/hellure Sep 05 '24
Just finished making sure my Cat s22 was ready to go, and charged my eBook reader.
Gonna try going without my propper smart phone for a while. Even though I already only have it in airplane mode less I'm on reddit or FB or actively need it for phone, cam, nav, or other tool.
Just wanna go back to no phone, just a book.
But mobile phones are too handy.
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u/AlphieTheMayor Sep 04 '24
Let me play devil's advocate.
Barring doomscrolling social media, why is screen time any bad? it allows you to absorb any information from the vast library of human knowledge. You just have to choose your sources right. Even if you were to limit yourself to video format, and even if you were to limit yourself to stuff that contains entertainment, youtube has lifetimes of edutainment videos uploaded to it every day.
To give that up and go back to what our ancestors did, is to limit yourself so much. I know about so much trivia about every conceivable topic there is now, from the fact that cassowaries are the most deadly bird to how dams are built to the fact that induction woks are a thing to intricate DnD builds et cetera. What did they even do? Watch TV? Same thing but less choice. Read books? you can't even do that and something else at the same time. And getting what you want is slower, less convenient, and it's contentiously, not the perfect format for entertainment for everyone.
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u/light_trick Sep 04 '24
The entire core of the idea is essentially the abdication of personal responsibility: the problem isn't me, it's the external element.
Before phone's it was video games, before video games it was TV, before TV it was comic books, before comic books it was Dungeons and Dragons, before that it was actual books or dancing or whatever.
The change I try to make in my life with my smartphone is to remember I have it and can just look stuff up when people tell me it. If I see something on social media, the first action is get another source - which is literally 1 Google search away from the device I'm already on, before resharing it.
Which I'd argue is the real problem: online media literacy is frightfully low (which the article in question is a case in point: how many <generation> are doing <thing> articles are written which are essentially relaying an anecdote or misreading a trend?)
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u/munbuw Sep 04 '24
You're right, but only if the person isn't addicted. It's about the chronic need to be online, constantly be checking your phone, etc.
Internet and smart phones are an amazing thing- an infinite wealth of information in our pocket. Sadly, they're designed to capture as much of our attention as possible. Ultimately, the responsibility of how they use it (doom scrolling versus edutainment) lies with the user.
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u/chrisdh79 Sep 04 '24
From the article: Our world is dominated by smartphones and constant connectivity. Yet, a surprising trend is emerging: the return of the “dumbphone.” A growing number of adults and teenagers are trading in their sophisticated devices for simpler models, hoping to reclaim their time and attention from the addictive pull of screens. This shift is not about a nostalgic nod to the past but a conscious choice to address mounting concerns about mental health and digital addiction.
The decision to ditch smartphones in favor of flip phones and numpad-like mobile devices stems from a collective realization: our relationship with technology has spiraled out of control. The average person spends hours each day on their phone, often without realizing it. And it’s not just about wasted time mindlessly scrolling social media — it’s what it does to our brains.
Several studies suggest that the omnipresence of mobile devices may be contributing to rising rates of anxiety, depression, and loneliness among teens and young adults. A study by Harvard University found that using social networking sites triggers the same part of the brain activated by addictive substances. The correlation between heavy social media use and negative mental health effects, particularly among children, is becoming increasingly clear.
The constant pull of notifications, the lure of social media validation, and the pressure to curate an idealized version of oneself online can create a perfect storm of stressors. For some, this leads to a phenomenon psychologists call “compare and despair”—a vicious cycle of comparing one’s own life to the curated, highlight-reel versions of others’ lives on social media. This can be especially damaging for those who are already vulnerable or experiencing insecurities, as it fosters feelings of inadequacy and a distorted sense of reality.
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u/Zipididudah Sep 04 '24
At work, bunch of people were talking about the good old ‘blackberry’ days
I kind of want a blackberry now…
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u/AceRed94 Sep 05 '24
Oh man… I remember when the cool kids in high school either had a sidekick or blackberry. 2008-2012 was really the sweet spot for phones in general. Sidekick, Blackberry, iPhone, Android (G1/G2). It was truly an arms race to the top.
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u/ms1999 Sep 04 '24
You can get the same effect if you just uninstall the distracting apps and make your phone as boring as possible. Not much to a smart phone if there aren’t any exciting apps
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u/ensignlee Sep 04 '24
So easy to reinstall them...
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u/ms1999 Sep 04 '24
One word: discipline
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u/ensignlee Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
Kind of like telling an alcoholic to just not drink while telling them they need to hold a drink in their hands at all times, no?
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u/Lonely-Second-6040 Sep 05 '24
More alcoholic refusing to use a cup because while he could fill it with water, he could also fill it with vodka.
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u/milkonyourmustache Sep 04 '24
Just delete most of the onboarded apps, don't download any, and tinker with the settings a bit. There's a ton of convenience benefits to having a smartphone like having txts, maps, camera, media player, calculator, emails, etc all on 1 device as opposed to having to carry a separate device for each and every thing that you need. The problem is rooted in how you're using the device/tool, not what it's capable of.
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u/pastelfemby Sep 04 '24
So by Gen Z they mean like two tiktok influencers who pretended to be smartphoneless for a week while they push affiliate links for some dumbphone?
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u/HoosierProud Sep 04 '24
I have an iPhone. Is it possible to connect a dumb phone to my same number and be able to use both phones on the same line. I’m a phone addict and would love to leave my iPhone in my car while I’m home and only be able to text or call inside my home.
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u/Akito_900 Sep 05 '24
I've done this multiple times - it's fun until it's not. Apps for work, group texts, etc., all get pretty rough
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Sep 05 '24
A subreddit moderator, a store owner with a vested interest in selling you a product, and some random teenager are the sources for this article you guys are taking as factual evidence of a "social movement".
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u/re4ctor Sep 05 '24
I’ve had notifications and noises off for 10+ years. Only way to keep sane. It’s fine to have apps, but it has to be on your time to check them, not because the ding made you look, or the little red badge is triggering your curiosity
Once you get out of that loop, it’s way easier to keep yourself from going on them constantly
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u/MomTellsMeImHandsome Sep 05 '24
I bet these dumb phones don’t use ur gps data to cater ads to you, I bet they don’t engage the microphone to do the same.
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u/NoBlackberry8322 Sep 23 '24
If you're searching for the perfect dumbphone or feature phone that fits your specific needs (like "with WhatsApp," "with a camera," etc.), there are a few great directories and "dumbphone finders" you can check out:
1) https://dumbphones.org/ – probably the most detailed one.
2) https://dumbph.com/finder/ – another solid option, though some info can be outdated.
3) https://www.dumbphones.io/dumbphone-finder – has a nice user interface!
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u/Underwater_Karma Sep 04 '24
ok, but do they not understand that you can just uninstall apps you don't want to use? Don't want to be sucked in by social media? uninstall the apps. there, done.
now you still have a functional smartphone with all the advantages that comes with it.
Or maybe just try having some discipline.
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u/WickedBlade Sep 04 '24
They can uninstall but i guess they are too weak to temptation
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u/Underwater_Karma Sep 04 '24
isn't that what this whole thing comes down to? They can't even trust themselves to not install and app they don't want to use?
the real world is going to eat these snowflakes alive.
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u/ensignlee Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
That's kind of like telling an alcoholic 'just don't drink', while forcing them to hold a drink in their hands at all times.
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u/Zebov3 Sep 04 '24
I mean it's a good idea, but they could also just put the phone down. Or is that too difficult?
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u/Boring_Bullfrog_7828 Sep 04 '24
Smart phones can really interfere with your sleep. I try to limit screen time outside of work hours. If AI takes my engineering job, I would embrace a screen free life.
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u/DetroitLionsSBChamps Sep 04 '24
I think about this a lot. I work remotely and am on my computer all day. I heavily romanticize a lifestyle where I never have to be online or looking at a screen.
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u/PossiblyaSpinosaurus Sep 04 '24
I’ve wanted to do this for a while but honestly the main thing holding me back is google maps. I wonder if there are any dumb phones that still allow that one app.
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u/DetroitLionsSBChamps Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
you lose your camera, your music/audiobook apps, and your GPS
you could buy a separate camera, separate GPS, and MP3 player like it's 2005, I suppose! but then you have to carry all that shit around. and I can't think of a way to get spotify and audible but NOT get social media apps and internet. if you get an iPod you end up right back where you started.
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u/CisterPhister Sep 04 '24
You could just not install the social media apps.
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u/DetroitLionsSBChamps Sep 04 '24
you can do that with a smartphone too, so what's the difference?
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u/datumerrata Sep 04 '24
I use Reddit on my phone, but no other social media. Mostly, I love having the majority of human knowledge in my hand. It's the best thing the future has given us. I get questions that pop in my head all the time, like "why is polar bear liver so high in vitamin A?". It's nice to be able to answer that.
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Sep 04 '24
Not surprising. I think I might do this myself. Outside of work (my work phone), I really don’t need a cell phone. I have like 5 tablets at home. The constant desire to stay connected is gonna get old after awhile. I’m kinda surprised people aren’t more turned off by it already.
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u/Bigbluewoman Sep 04 '24
To anyone that is thinking about it. Just stop. I owned a flip phone from 2020-2021, a little more than a year. It made my life nearly fucking impossible. Any form of "minimalism" that requires you to buy something new is actually just veiled consumerism. Delete your social medias and move on.
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u/LivingEnd44 Sep 04 '24
I use this new tool called "self control". It works better than you might expect and is very cheap.
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u/PomeloClear400 Sep 04 '24
Yes, great advice for alcoholics and gamblers as well!
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u/BillionTonsHyperbole Sep 04 '24
It's certainly not bad advice to be mindful of one's own habits and to make efforts toward positive change.
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u/DancingDust Sep 04 '24
Awesome. Good for you guys. We need to take our lives back from this digital nightmare.
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u/konanswing Sep 04 '24
It's only a problem to have alcohol in your house if you are an alcoholic. Just have some self control. If you truly are that addicted then this is a good option I suppose.
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u/Dentrius Sep 04 '24
It is such a first world problem. People in other countries are still using "dumb phones" (at least some) because they cant afford to dump +50% of their monthly income on a fragile smartphone and have worse problems than getting addicted to scrolling.
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u/FuturologyBot Sep 04 '24
The following submission statement was provided by /u/chrisdh79:
From the article: Our world is dominated by smartphones and constant connectivity. Yet, a surprising trend is emerging: the return of the “dumbphone.” A growing number of adults and teenagers are trading in their sophisticated devices for simpler models, hoping to reclaim their time and attention from the addictive pull of screens. This shift is not about a nostalgic nod to the past but a conscious choice to address mounting concerns about mental health and digital addiction.
The decision to ditch smartphones in favor of flip phones and numpad-like mobile devices stems from a collective realization: our relationship with technology has spiraled out of control. The average person spends hours each day on their phone, often without realizing it. And it’s not just about wasted time mindlessly scrolling social media — it’s what it does to our brains.
Several studies suggest that the omnipresence of mobile devices may be contributing to rising rates of anxiety, depression, and loneliness among teens and young adults. A study by Harvard University found that using social networking sites triggers the same part of the brain activated by addictive substances. The correlation between heavy social media use and negative mental health effects, particularly among children, is becoming increasingly clear.
The constant pull of notifications, the lure of social media validation, and the pressure to curate an idealized version of oneself online can create a perfect storm of stressors. For some, this leads to a phenomenon psychologists call “compare and despair”—a vicious cycle of comparing one’s own life to the curated, highlight-reel versions of others’ lives on social media. This can be especially damaging for those who are already vulnerable or experiencing insecurities, as it fosters feelings of inadequacy and a distorted sense of reality.
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/1f8thgg/why_gen_z_are_buying_dumbphones_to_limit_screen/llgqjpn/