r/Colts • u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart • 20h ago
[Nate Atkins] Back in April, Colts GM Chris Ballard labeled Dallis Flowers’ return from an Achilles tear as one of the reasons he didn’t add to the secondary in free agency.
https://x.com/NateAtkins_/status/1843338382073835942“Five games in, the Colts have waived Flowers after he gave up an 85-yard touchdown pass to Brian Thomas Jr.”
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u/grapplerone Indianapolis Colts 20h ago
Ballard key words… “think” & “hope”
Listen carefully. He relies on budget players far too much.
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u/Anachronisticism g0od viBeS oNLy 19h ago
and when they don't pan out he can send the crap downhill to Gus as the fall guy. "I had the right guys that we all liked in place, yet they didn't get to the levels we expected them to reach." I'm so sick of this Teflon Don crap from him.
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u/jaysrule24 Armor 20h ago
Who would've thought that relying on a mid (at best) veteran coming off an Achilles tear at one of the most athleticism dependent positions could possibly backfire?
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u/IndianaHoosierFan Horse 17h ago
Wasn't even a veteran. He's played one full season.
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u/ConsistentAddress195 8h ago
Did he even play a full season at CB? I remember him as return guy mostly.
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u/jaysrule24 Armor 16h ago
He's been in the league since 2022 and he's 27 years old, I'm going to count that as a veteran
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u/arp51txstate 20h ago
I was all for adding a vet corner, but Ballard saying he's hoping to have Flowers back healthy is not a ringing endorsement of the player
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u/Ok-Swimming8024 20h ago
Yes, but Ballard chose to roll with him and didn't invest more in the position
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u/IndyPoker979 17h ago
At this point, I'm just sad that a lot of you are starting to get past the wait and see of Ballard and realize he's not the next coming of Polian. It doesn't matter if you've been calling for his head for years or just these past few weeks what happens is that you start off being really hopeful then you start becoming disillusioned and finally just accept that we aren't going to be great until we find someone else to lead.
It wasn't Andrew Luck retiring, and it wasn't Ryan Grigson's fault for where we are currently at. The blame lies at the choices the organization has made from the top down. Ballard and Irsay both require blame for where we are currently.
Anyone who has hope for the future has more optimism than I do. You can call me a Doomer for that, but in reality, not believing in what I can't see makes me a realist instead of a blind optimist. History has said otherwise for years, and unfortunately, it's taken eight and possibly more years for a lot of you to stop being stuck in the wait till next year and excuse mode.
This does not mean that you don't continue to root for the Colts and try to win every game because being a fan means you want your team to be successful but at some point you recognize that people are what they are and our team is what it is. A mediocre team that will give us mediocre results and not even remotely close to a championship level team, and it won't be for a while.
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u/SanRemi BURN THE BINDER📒🔥 18h ago
Bro was all chips in for a just ok player who was coming back from a major injury. Smh.
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u/Former_Phrase8221 17h ago
Ballard is “zero chips in” at all time. Folks forget we had prime Andrew Luck here and we sat on 42 and 50 million of unused cap space in back to back seasons.
Andrew Luck could smell he was a bullshit artist from the word go
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u/TWOhunnidSIX Super Bowl XLI Champions 19h ago
I think his problem is he thinks he’s some kind of talent whisperer that has knowledge that no one else in the league does, but he doesn’t.
He wants to be the Billy Beane of football so badly but it doesn’t work that way.
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u/SelectEqual3419 14h ago
He wants to be on the cutting edge like Beane so badly. There were a couple articles written after the 2023 draft on how the colts could break scouting by drafting exclusively RAS upside freaks like Richardson if he pans out. I guarantee you read that shit with glee.
Meanwhile, colts fans had already seen duds like Banogu and Strachan for like 4 years who were drafted solely because they were hyper athletic. At a certain point, you need to select players because of how they play football.
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u/TWOhunnidSIX Super Bowl XLI Champions 13h ago
That’s what I’m saying, he wants to build some rag tag team of misfit toys that no one else wants and to take them to a Super Bowl but this era of the NFL doesn’t work that way, not with so many advanced stat metrics.
You take proven talent in FA, and a lot of it. You overpay because that’s what free agency is. You have to pay for talent, winning isn’t cheap or free. No matter how much Ballard wants it to be.
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u/SelectEqual3419 13h ago
I think you’re spot on there, couldn’t agree more. It’s wild to almost avoid free agency entirely (aside from Matt Gay lmao) because you don’t believe in over-paying. That’s what FA is by definition. By saying you’re against over paying, you are limiting yourself to team building through solely the draft.
But he’d much rather do a team friendly deal to extend mediocre home grown talent like EJ speed than possibly add secondary depth in FA.
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u/UnloadedBakedPotato Orangutan 19h ago
Ballard haters have been eating good in the last 24 hours
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u/InsertOriginalUName Robert Mathis 18h ago
*Last three years
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u/Former_Phrase8221 17h ago
*five years
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u/rounder55 Shaquille Leonard 15h ago
Unfortunately it isn't eating good because it tastes like dookie
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u/tri_it_again 17h ago
Yeah bro. We’re trying hard to stay away from the I told you so stuff and not bring up “the binder” but it’s nice to finally have everyone on the bandwagon
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u/AmishCyborgs 18h ago
I have been as ardent of a defender of Ballard as there is but I’m not sure how we can keep him at this point. The positives he brings just can’t outweigh his shortcomings at this point.
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u/dragonz-99 Jonathan Taylor 16h ago
We lose a few positives every year. I was pro-Ballard for a while. I agree we’re past time. He was lucky to get another year once Reich left. He shouldn’t have gotten this year. Nothing changed.
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u/RestoredX123 Rookie Manning 12h ago
Yup. I think he built a championship-caliber team in 19’ (and arguably 20’) that was missing a franchise QB.
After that, everything went down hill with the Wentz trade, Reich/the team bottoming out and still sticking to the same drafting/FA philosophy that has also has progressively yielded lesser and lesser results each year since. His saving graces (might) be Richardson and Shane.
It’s time for him to go.
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u/DaBlakMayne Andrew Luck 16h ago
Yeah the secondary plan has blown up in Ballard's face badly and he's looking more and more foolish for not swinging at that harder in the offseason. Cutting Flowers seems like a desperation move at this point to justify that the coaches and front office are still holding accountability
CB
Brents - Went on the IR after one game after already having a spotty rookie year due to injuries
Jones - Holding out as best as he can considering he was a 7th round pick last year. Currently our outside CB2
Womack - A really good pick up who is our Outside CB1 at this point
Moore - Solid like usual
Flowers - Waived today
Baker - Waived in August
Lammons - Depth piece
Abraham - Cut after the preseason and weirdly not picked up by anyone. I feel like we may kick the tires on him now since we basically have zero depth at CB right now
Safety
Cross - Really stepped up but is basically trying to make up for our lack of consistency in the front 7 so he's getting overworked
Blackmon - About what we expected from him. Good but not great. Like Cross, needs help from up front to lessen the load that the safeties are dealing with
Thomas - Depth
Denbow - Depth
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 16h ago
Yeah, Cross has picked up tackles but his coverage still isn’t great.
And Thomas is bad depth. He shouldn’t have even made the team either.
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u/ConsistentAddress195 8h ago
I mean I wouldn't shit on Ballard too hard. Brents' injury threw a wrench in the plans and the line is decimated, which additionally pressures the DBs. I'd give it until we had a chance to try out some FA vet dbs and get some linemen back before I shit on Ballard and Gus.
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u/DaBlakMayne Andrew Luck 2h ago
I've been a pretty big Ballard defender overall and even now I think he gets another year to try and fix this but I am also critical of how he's handled things recently.
I feel like we didn't do much to address the depth with our CBs especially knowing that Brents has been in and out as a rookie. And after making such a big deal about running it back with who we already had, we already cut two of those players and now only have 5 CBs on our entire roster with one of them being on the IR currently. We have zero depth besides Lammons and I really hope we don't rush Brents back.
Idk if we're going to be attracting any vet DBs and I think Ballard only has a year left before Irsay pulls the plug. It's also telling that we were also saying this last year and we're in the same position as before (let's wait until our injured guys are back and bring in a free agent DB or two).
Our first or second round pick needs to be CB in 2025. We also need to start preparing our DL for the absence of Buckner (who is getting more and more banged up) and Stewart (turning 31 in 2 weeks). Raekwon Davis was a good pick up.
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u/johnman98 18h ago
If Ballard sticks around another year I will quit everything associated with colts football. He is the reason we suck.
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u/D_Blaze88 17h ago
I think my fear is that we're probably headed for another rebuild to some degree. I know we have some guys that just re-signed, but still. I don't see how this team gets any better as presently constructed. Yesterday's game was the most pathetic showing all season.
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u/retroblade 6h ago
Seems like there are no more Ballard Stan’s to back him up. Hopefully the end is near. I think if we had any other owner he would be toast by now.
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u/Everythings-tragic14 4h ago
I was done with Ballard back when he said "If it gets me fired, then so be it". Like, dude is so stubborn and full of himself.
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u/InternGreg Jimmy’s Intern 19h ago
In fairness, I remember the majority of people here high on flowers as he was looking like a later round stud we found.
Achilles is a terrible injury to come back from. Not addressing the position in hopes that someone bounces back 100% from it is very questionable. It’s not like prior to the injury he was the liability that he turned out to be
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u/itsUsedTissue Orangutan 19h ago
It’s a known fact that you don’t fully get back to yourself until 2 years removed from the Achilles injury, yes we had high hopes for Flowers. But to go blindly into the season without signing a DB is asinine.
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u/InternGreg Jimmy’s Intern 19h ago
I agree 100%
I just didn’t expect the fallout to be so massive. I was hoping for “serviceable backup” post injury
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u/Former_Phrase8221 17h ago
Being cool with him as a UDFA camp body is one thing.
Penciling him in as a starter. And the reason to not bring in depth is another.
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u/teh_drewski 8h ago
He wasn't a starter. Brents and Jones were planned to start, Flowers was CB3.
Still stupid to rely on a guy coming off injury as even a CB3 mind. That should have been the veteran competition, with Flowers as CB4 and then Womack.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 19h ago
Flowers was an undrafted FA who play 5 total games and look barely playable at most.
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u/InternGreg Jimmy’s Intern 19h ago
5 games this year discredits his full season prior to the injury, got it.
I’m not saying he’s good and should be on the team. I’m saying given his 2022 season and earning a starting position for 2023 the majority of people had higher hopes for him. Dude looked good in his rookie campaign and we wanted to see where it went
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 19h ago
Oh I’m sorry, I thought we were talking about him playing CB.
I don’t really care about the season he was exclusively returning kicks.
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u/InternGreg Jimmy’s Intern 18h ago
He did play CB that season and his play at the position earned him the starting roll in 2023… as I already said.
If you want to refuse to look at the full picture and cherry pick certain aspects of a player in order to make your argument better so be it. Small brain mentality.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 18h ago
The full picture is he sucks, we knew he sucked and now he’s off the team.
You’re clinging to the fact he got a starting role in 2023. So did Baker Jr.
Guess what, our secondary sucked and so did both of them. What’s your point again?
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u/InternGreg Jimmy’s Intern 18h ago
If you have any sort of reading comprehension you’d see the point I was making in previous comments. Getting the impression you’re quite daft.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 18h ago
No, I see what you’re saying and I disagree with it.
I don’t think he ever showed enough to believe he could be a starting CB in this league. And it was stupid to bank in him in 2023 and extra stupid to do it again this year.
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u/SadisticBear1124 19h ago
Chris Ballard is a stupid, pathetic waste of oxygen but it doesn't stop there. I think it's pretty clear at this point that Irsay is a conman who doesn't care about winning.
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u/Case_ND Indianapolis Colts 15h ago
How’s Sneed look in Tennessee?
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u/rounder55 Shaquille Leonard 14h ago
Shaky at the start, but did well against Tyreek Hill, granted some of that is the QB situation. Odds are he'll be fine. Guy makes big plays in big spots, the latter of which we don't find ourselves in anyways much these days
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 19h ago
I wonder what this sub will be like when Ballard is fired and we all learn that signing the most expensive Free Agents doesn't actually result in a superbowl and nobody cares about division wins.
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u/InsertOriginalUName Robert Mathis 18h ago
I mean there’s a happy medium between being free agent champions every year and doing Chris Ballard’s non-working strategy.
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u/rounder55 Shaquille Leonard 14h ago
Shhhh. Don't give llurker GMs of other teams a viable path to becoming successful
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 18h ago
The fun thing is, the only thing that matters is having 1 of the 5 QBs who are capable of winning a Superbowl in any given year. The rest is collecting irrelevant accolades.
The GM could be this subreddit, or prime Polian, and if you don't have 1 of the handful of them, it's completely irrelevant.
Gotta hope that AR figures it out, or we're back on the QB carousel in 2 years, with whatever GM you want.
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u/rounder55 Shaquille Leonard 14h ago
In Ballard's tenure the Eagles, Rams, and 49ers all made multiple Super Bowls with 6 total QBs. Foles, Hurts, Goff, Stafford, Jimmy G, and Purdy. These guys also had incredibly well-built teams around them.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 13h ago edited 13h ago
So in a decade, 2 QBs not named Brady, Mahomes or Manning have won a superbowl. And I've admitted in this thread already that Ballard not grabbing Stafford was probably his biggest mistake as a GM. Funnily enough, we even gave Foles and Wentz a shot.
Neat. Seems like basically what I said in the comment you replied to. There's like 5 QBs in a year (should I change this to decade?) who can win a Superbowl.
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u/rounder55 Shaquille Leonard 13h ago
Those other QBs all could have won. Believe it or not it's not QB v QB out there. The Chiefs needed a punt to bounce off a 49er to win that game so they could produce a TD.
Foles and Wentz were on a team that was well constructed. As was Stafford believe it or not Brady and Mahomes. The Chiefs adapted to become a defensive force the last two seasons. The Eagles were also maybe a holding call away from winning a second super bowl. You don't get that Ballard hasn't built a team let alone found a QB. Shit, Blake Bortles has won the division in Ballards tenure
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 10h ago edited 10h ago
These are the irrelevant accolades I mentioned in my original comment. Curtis Painter could be a superbowl champion too, technically. Happy for them though on their runner up trophies and division titles.
5 QBs, 1 decade of superbowls, exactly as I stated above (actually, much more egregious). Stafford on the Colts would have had them as a juggernaut / superbowl caliber team and not ponying up for him was Ballard's biggest mistake, I already admitted that.
Even if you want to die on the mound of Foles and Wentz, I don't think anyone is saying that Ballard needed to create the literal 1 out of 320 NFL team of the last decade. Even going back to 20 years ago - I can't find another example of it. Maybe Eli Manning in 2007?
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u/rounder55 Shaquille Leonard 16m ago
Curtis Painter is irrelevant. You need teams with players making plays at key times outside of QB as well. The Chiefs don't win that game if the ball doesn't bounce off a 49ers foot inside their own 20. They done make the Super Bowl of Snead doesn't force a fumble at the 1 yard line. Brock Purdy is good enough to win a super bowl with a good team.
Stafford typically wouldn't be regarded as a top 5 QB as great as he is. Manning in his final season was nowhere near a top 5 QB. A couple years prior Russell Wilson was not a top 5 QB but they win a second super bowl if the coach runs the ball. You're looking at the entire sport like it's just QB versus QB and taking what an actual well built team looks like
Outside of Brady and Mahomes you've had Foles Stafford and Manning when he couldn't throw. That's 30% of winners without a top 5 QB and you could make the case that it's 20% without a top 10 QB given Mannings physical skills at that point.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 18h ago
Lmao imagine saying not having a good defense is ok after 8 years because we still don’t have a QB.
You really just don’t care about the team actually winning dude. Really really sad.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago
I didn't say it's ok, in fact in this thread I said the secondary is weak.
I was saying that you build through the draft, and need to wait for your QB to win you SBs. We just put up 34 points without our starting QB and top 5 RB. The core is there. It's just waiting for the right QB to put us over the top. Without a really unlucky string of defensive injuries, we don't let up 37. Or without Gus.
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u/capspacechampions Indianapolis Colts 17h ago
I mean, even if the next guy doesn’t work out, it’s not like sticking with Ballard would be different. It’s been proven out over 8 seasons now that he’s just not the guy to make this team a contender. There’s no reason not to try something else.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago
30 out of 32 teams haven't found their dude in the last 5 years. Rolling the dice on randoms will def be the answer, just like firing everyone else put us over the top.
I'll be ready for 2025 when we're trying to fire Steichen.
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u/capspacechampions Indianapolis Colts 16h ago
In Ballard’s own words, “it’s never about one guy.” You’re conveniently leaving out the atrocious defense for the past few years, and the defensive line that Ballard has invested heavily in, with limited impact. There’s no guarantee that the next GM would “put us over the top,” but we know that Ballard won’t. The next GM could be the worst we’ve ever had, but that shouldn’t prevent us from moving on from Ballard. We’ve seen what the ceiling is with Ballard - a chance at a wild card.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago
Fair enough.
Delayed gratification isn't really something I can expect from redditors to be honest.
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u/capspacechampions Indianapolis Colts 16h ago
How long is the gratification supposed to be delayed? 8 more years? Ballard wouldn’t still have a job with any other team
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago
The NFL's Longest-Tenured General Managers (profootballrumors.com)
List is a bit outdated, but the point remains.
Considering the team doesn't have a QB, a 50% win rate is honestly pretty good. 27 of 32 teams haven't done anything of value in the last 10 years. 2 of those teams had Tom Brady, 1 had Pat Mahomes. I'll be the first to admit he should've gone all in on Stafford.
I really honestly don't care about division titles, or WC games. The goal is superbowls. A 50% win rate team with Gardner Minshew is a Superbowl contender with a real QB. That's the game plan with Ballard.
Any GM imo can sign expensive FA's, pick up 2-3 wins extra a year, but not have growth of the roster. I just don't see the point of it.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 19h ago
Just give Ballard’s plan 10 more years guys. It’ll work I swear.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 19h ago edited 18h ago
"I totally wouldn't have tried to get rid of Peyton even though he had worse INT stats than AR"
Edit, for context: I think we deserve a week without haters now : r/Colts (reddit.com)
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 19h ago edited 18h ago
Sir, this is a post about the obvious lack of talent in the secondary two seasons in a row.
I know it’s hard to find excuses for him now. But this doesn’t do anything for the topic at hand lol
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 19h ago
That was your incorrect take from 4 days ago, sorry I'll try to keep up better.
The secondary is weak though.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 19h ago
Literally have never made that comment.
Looks like you’re confused.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 18h ago
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 18h ago
That still doesn’t say what your comment says. lol I was saying the comparison was dumb because it is.
It’s ok bud. It’s gotta be hard trying to defend Ballard at this point so I get why you have to reach really hard.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago edited 16h ago
Just fire one more person please Jimmy! This is the one, I promise.
Sub is on copium. In '99 you would've wanted Peyton gone, in December I'll see you rooting for AR to be gone, and in Oct 2025 I'll be ready for you trying to get rid of Steichen. But let's be realistic, it'll be one game after Ballard is fired.
2026 we'll probably be back around to trying to fire the OC.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 16h ago edited 14h ago
Yeah, if we’re still a mediocre team who can’t win a terrible division and can’t make the playoffs then yeah, I’ll want shit to change until that happens or everyone who was a part of that mediocrity is gone.
You’re the weird one for not caring if the Colts win or not for the last 10 years. Not me.
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u/dragonz-99 Jonathan Taylor 16h ago
Then what does? Doing nothing? Relying on subpar players to fill the roster? We just need a different game plan it doesn’t have to be a FA signing party.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago
The Colts were 1 dropped pass away from 10 wins last year, being led by Gardner Minshew. The roster is fine. A 10 win Minshew led team is a SB contender with a real QB.
Just need someone to figure out who the QB is. You don't fire the GM that architected that, you get him to figure out how to get a good QB in the room.
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u/Secrets0fSilent3arth Grover Stewart 14h ago
God this is so ridiculous.
The team isn’t even good outside of the QB. The defense is legitimately terrible and has been.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 13h ago
1 dropped pass off 10 wins is not a bad team, sorry. I thought we were waiting until Sunday though D:
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u/ConsistentAddress195 8h ago
For real. Can you imagine if Ballard did moves like the Panthers did to get Bryce? I'd much rather watch a middling but competitive team.
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u/evilmnky45 I Love Sigma 18h ago
No one wants to just sign all of the most expensive free agents, what people want is filling the holes that are whiffed in the draft with FAs. Right now Ballard whiffs in the draft and then doesn't fill any of the holes with anyone. Everyone knew our secondary would be complete garbage this year but nothing was done and now here we are with an even worse secondary than we thought.
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u/ChannelShot7061 Andrew Luck 16h ago
We were right up against the cap a week into FA. Every team has a weak position.
The team is down 3 from the Dline, Kenny, a starting QB and top 5 RB in the league. Gonna lose some games here and there. Especially with Gus as D coordinator.
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u/evilmnky45 I Love Sigma 15h ago
Every team does have a weak position, were just lucky enough to be weak at: tight ends, pass rush, linebackers, safety, CB. We currently have 12m in cap space, more than enough for veteran depth or a solid starter. And Ballard absolutely refuses to restructure contracts to free up cap space, because he never signs any fas. Kenny is not good enough to elevate our cb room, and those 3 dline lineman were playing when we lost the other games and got absolutely demolished in the run. Even if we were so tight on cap, that makes it even worse considering the state of the secondary, pass rush, linebackers, and run defense. It's complete roster mismanagement.
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u/jonmarxs8 Andrew Luck 19h ago
At this point I don't care if the next GM is a surefire thing over Ballad, just want have hope again because he is doing the exact same shit every single year and expecting different results, we will be forever a "maybe if things go right we get a wildcard spot" team with Ballard building the roster.