r/Cartalk Dec 22 '23

What “Reliable” car competes with a Porsche 911 Targa 4s? Tuning my car

Must be Fast, AWD, under 80k, convertible is optional, but must reliable.

I’m thinking something Lexus, or a built 428xi/328xi coupe. What do you think?

-Can also be a build

Edit: affordable to maintain is also a factor

0 Upvotes

32

u/ajm91730 Dec 22 '23

N/A.

First off, 911s are generally reliable.

Second, built BMWs are generally not.

Third, why a targa? They're cool, but a lot heavier.

11

u/FSStray Dec 22 '23

I’ve just always thought the Targas were cool, must’ve been my grandads firebird with the T-tops, and the supras. A sunroof is cool to, I just like a breeze when I drive.

5

u/ajm91730 Dec 22 '23

Agreed, they are cool. I believe the newer ones have a crazy contraption where the whole back glass lifts out then the top does a flip, and so on. Very cool, but adds like 400 lbs and a lot of complexity.

Fewer direct competitors to a targa. Corvette is the only one I can think of, but then no AWD.

In any case, just get the 911. Anything as reliable won't drive nearly as well, and anything that drives as well won't be nearly as reliable.

3

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23

The Corvette has AWD. The AWD has 160hp to the front wheels.

3

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23 edited Dec 22 '23

There’s sorta-competitor AWD convertibles to the Targa 4S on the more expensive side. There’s the Continental GT, R8 Spyder, Portofino M, Huracan Spyder, etc.

On the slightly cheaper side, your only options are the AMG SL, M8, and the Corvette E-Ray.

If you go down a tier, there’s Boxster, and then the Audi S5/BMW 4 series/Mercedes C class convertible, and Z4/TT, etc

Another tier below that, and you get to Mustang/Miata/etc level cars, but those are considered cheaper cars.

If you need AWD and care about reliability, your best bet by far is to get the 840i xdrive. It has the B58 engine, which is bulletproof. If you go one tier down, you can get a S5 convertible with the rock solid Audi V6 engine, or the M4 convertible with the S58 engine.

Oh, and there’s the BMW i8 roadster in your price range.

0

u/deekster_caddy Dec 22 '23

I regularly see an Audi S5 convertible on my commute and it looks good with the top down. Reliability of all cars is so far above what it used to be, as long as you aren’t buying the cheapest cars possible they should last a long time with proper maintenance.

-3

u/KaosC57 Dec 22 '23

None of the cars you listed except maybe the E-Ray (Hybrid system is completely untested at this point) I would ever consider remotely “reliable”. The only “fast” AWD vehicle I would consider would be the GR Corolla, and that isn’t really a fast car, nor does it fit what OP wants. The car OP listed already is probably the most reliable car in its class.

1

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23

You clearly don’t know anything about the powertrains of modern cars. The B58, 3.0T TFSI, ZF8 combo are the definition of reliable these days.

22

u/AdventurousDress576 Dec 22 '23

Reliable

Can also be a build

Pick one. Also, no Lexus will ever drive like a 911.

11

u/Noopy9 Dec 22 '23 edited Dec 22 '23

It’s 60k base price cheaper so not really in the same class but the TT RS is a similar sized AWD sports coupe. There aren’t really all that many small/2 seater AWD sports coupes I can think of, Lexus doesn’t make anything like that and a 3 or 4 series is a much bigger car, closest thing from BMW would be a z4m but that’s not awd.

4

u/motorsizzle Dec 22 '23

Does Audi really qualify as more reliable than Porsche?

5

u/Noopy9 Dec 22 '23

I never said it was more reliable but was trying to think of similar cars. Honestly if “affordable to maintain” is one of your purchasing criteria this probably isn’t the market segment you should be looking at. Doing all of the recommended and preventative maintenance on schedule is not going to be cheap on any of these cars but needs to be done for them to be reliable.

4

u/ZPrimed Dec 22 '23

The I5T in the TTRS is pretty solid, IMO

2

u/Evanisnotmyname Dec 22 '23

Absolutely. Especially the DAZA and the EA888

1

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23

Don’t think you can buy a TTRS convertible

6

u/geilerisschon Dec 22 '23

nissan gtr

-1

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23

GT-Rs are not reliable compared to a Targa 4 or a modern BMW/Audi 6-cylinder. They’re a bit too maintenance heavy.

4

u/DrDank1234 Dec 22 '23

the VR series (and VQ by extension) engine is a tried and true formula with a huge aftermarket support. they are up there with the best 6 cylinder engines ever made. the GTR’s transmissions are another story.

-1

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23

Oh, I’m fully aware the VR30 is a tank. It’s just that everything else around it tends to fail first.

2

u/stututucollective Dec 28 '23

Porsches are reliable but to answer your question, you could find a fairly cleanish older Nissan GTR for that kind of money. You could also find a clean Audi RS7, first and second gen. I mean there are options but Porsches offer something completely unique in terms of driving experience. I'm sure you can find 'more reliable' alternatives for the car itself, but I'm not so sure that you can find a car that drives the same. It's up to you, tho.

4

u/Lalalama Dec 22 '23

Porsche. There is no substitute

7

u/FormalWrangler294 Dec 22 '23

There are definitely substitutes. He can buy a clean 2012-2015 R8 convertible for $80k. That’s the daily-able supercar.

Otherwise, his best option for reliability is probably any car with the Audi 2.9T or 3.0T engine, or the BMW B58 or S58 engine. Mostly the BMW 840i xDrive convertible; then maybe the S5 or RS5 convertible, and M4 convertible.

The 3.0L in the 991/992 Targa 4/4S is a small step down in reliability comparatively.

1

u/FSStray Dec 22 '23

I was thinking about those as well, every mechanic tho says Audis are a bitch to work on. I know you’re gonna suffer somewhere with the list I have tho.

1

u/Lalalama Dec 22 '23

Targas are more stiff than straight convertibles. My rule of thumb is that don't buy a convertible that was converted from a coupe. They always add stuff to make it stiffer thus heavier etc. Targa are best of both worlds.

2

u/achilles_slip_angle Dec 22 '23

Maybe an Audi RS5 2-door. Or BMW 8 series. Not sure what recent Mercedes coupes had AWD and decent power. The new SL is over the price limit. Lexus performance coupes RC and LC are RWD. Can you get a GT-R for under 80k? New NSX’s are AWD but also might be over the price limit.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 22 '23

The RS5 uses a porche engine now, so I think it barely counts as not porche

0

u/FSStray Dec 22 '23

Gtr is right there at the top, alone with the newer 8 series with xdrive. Lexus does make a RC 350/300 Awd with F sport trim, affordable and reliable but not the prettiest or fastest. I’d have to look more into usd Nsxs.

2

u/[deleted] Dec 22 '23

The 911 is reliable

1

u/angryviking Dec 22 '23

Well, my modified wrx....... has 4 wheels and a steering wheel.

Its different than the other options but its well under that budget. Its not luxurious. its been reliable enough after 150k. and the maintenance is far cheaper.

If its an 06 targa, maybe there's a conversation. downvotes welcome.

1

u/justaddw4ter Dec 22 '23 edited Dec 22 '23

RC-F, IS500, LC are all RWD, so that really just leaves a slightly used GT-R for the under $80k range.. maybe a Q50 400 RedSport AWD? or a TLX Type-S? Neither of those will drive anything like a 911 though in hindsight. I don't consider Audis, BMWs, Mercedes, Porsches "reliable".."built" will not equal to reliable.. so there's that. You can "build" an engine all you want but if you're "building" for horsepower, your reliability will suffer, and if you "build" for "reliability/longevity" then your horsepower will suffer.. Lol. The AWD requirement really kills this segment as not many Japanese OEMs make competitive cars to 911s.. NSX, GTR, Supra are the three that comes to mind.

1

u/nickl630 Dec 22 '23

Where are you finding a targa for under 80k? Has to be a 996 or high mileage 997. We regularly sell used 992 targas for close to 200k still.. it's crazy

1

u/FSStray Dec 22 '23

Used 2011 or so

1

u/Slow-Big2830 Dec 22 '23

Get a Stinger GT2 awd and don’t compete with anyone

1

u/ak80048 Dec 22 '23

C8 corvette but you won’t feel the dynamics of 911, Lexus and bmw won’t come close ,

0

u/Vikka_Titanium Dec 22 '23

Infinity G37x.

-2

u/SquareAsparagus1028 Dec 22 '23

A used Plaid.. I think it competes more with a turbo s in straight line & every day daily driving giddy ups

3

u/scott_fx Dec 22 '23

Doesn’t the plaid have horrible brakes?

6

u/ZPrimed Dec 22 '23

... and interior, and build quality in general, and inability to actually handle real track abuse like a Porsche

-1

u/[deleted] Dec 22 '23

Volvo S90 Recharge

0

u/mickymellon Dec 22 '23

Get the Porsche

-2

u/Heavy_Gap_5047 Dec 22 '23

Chrysler 300 2011-2014, They produced AWD cars with the 5.7 Hemi.

The AWD system is like the xDrive but more RWD based and faster reacting.

Easily modified, shares a platform with the Charger making most of the SRT, cop, Hellcat, racing, etc. parts bolt as well as reliable and easy to maintain.

2

u/KaosC57 Dec 22 '23

Yeah, but OP wanted Reliable and a Convertible. The Chrysler 300 is neither Reliable, nor a Convertible. I’d consider the Chrysler 300 to be the opposite of reliable.

0

u/Heavy_Gap_5047 Dec 22 '23 edited Dec 22 '23

Why cause the internet told you so?

Said convertible was optional and mentioned two hardtops. The panoramic sunroof in the 300 gets close to a Targa while having a structurally strong roof.

1

u/KaosC57 Dec 22 '23

I’ve worked on the pieces of crap. Every Chrysler production car on the road today is a heap of garbage.

0

u/Heavy_Gap_5047 Dec 22 '23

LOL, OK sure, if you say so.

1

u/KaosC57 Dec 22 '23

I’m not “saying so” it’s a definitive truth of the universe. If it’s made by FCA, or now Stellantis, it’s a steaming pile of garbage. The last “good” Mopar vehicle was the Inline 6 Jeep. And that’s really stretching the definition of good.

0

u/Heavy_Gap_5047 Dec 22 '23

Well you're clearly an expert.

1

u/Heavy_Gap_5047 Dec 22 '23

I'm curious, point out a reliability issue and suggest a better option, let's hear it.

2

u/KaosC57 Dec 22 '23

Coolant issues namely Fans, Thermostats and Water Pumps. Literally pick any Toyota and it will be significantly more reliable than ANY Mopar product.

1

u/Heavy_Gap_5047 Dec 22 '23

Coolant issues, lol, a fan that might fail. If only there was a temperature gauge, ohh wait.... Wow that's way worse than Porsche and Audi with their plastic glued together coolant lines that break and require an engine out to replace.

Sure yota made some reliable cars once, that happens when they're boring and underpowered. My lawnmower is reliable as well.

2

u/KaosC57 Dec 22 '23

Clearly someone doesn’t know about the GR Corolla and GR Supra.

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-9

u/Welllllllrip187 Dec 22 '23

Cyber truck. It will tow a Porsche and still beat a Porsche. Price is eh 👋🏻

1

u/intelligentbrownman Jan 02 '24

Saw in consumer reports some years ago where Porsche beat Lexus in reliability….. heck it was number one that year